Valvoline VR1 racing oil in name only

Tex, ROFLMAO

Still runnin' Rotella in all my stuff.Straight 40, T 1, 1200 PPM on the ZDDP. More than ample with all the engines I own.. JMHO

Well, apparently not everyone cares to look at test results and simply go by marketing verbiage. As everyone should know by now, people in marketing typically don't know much beyond how to sell a product.   Of all the oils that are called. Vr1,   only the 20/50 not street legal has been shown in tests to have enough zddp.   I think if anyone has any doubts, they need to test their oil.   

Now, anyone blindly using rotella or any diesel oil because it was once thought it was ok to use in gas is sadly the most ignorant by far.

There is a lot of great info on this thread, using diesel oil is definitely not any part of that.
Even the napa guy instantly said not to use diesel oil in a flat tappet gas motor as the extra detergents wipe the zinc off the lobes, negating any decent levels (if any) of zddp. I've yet to see any technical data to discount that.

Guys..............seriously.....I am not sure why we are pissing on each other. I am just trying to change my oil. Boatdr, if you had just come on and said "use Rotella 4ow, it has 1300ppm of zddp, I would have that at my house for my oil change tomorrow. If you follow the thread, you will find I in no way claim to be an expert.I am seeking knowledge. It seems like you are inferring that I am claiming to be an expert and being Obama like. Stop doing that. You are making me cry. Horkn, dude, I posted the info from the Valvoline website. I thought people would be interested. Sorry I crossed the line there somehow Anyhoo, heres what I will send Valvoline:
Dear Valvoline,
Could you tell me the ZDDP content of your VR1 product? What does 13% equate to in PPM. It seems that 1200 PPM or above is the target for our boat engines due the the tappets. Do you also have a fact sheet that actually has that included? I would love to post that to solve some dispute amongst ourselves.
Thank You,
Tom

Will that work? Does anyone have more mean stuff to say me now? I am going to have to go to therapy after this

Tom, please don't take anything I posted in a negative light. I, like you only want my motor to run happily for as long as possible.

Be careful about what marketing and customer service say. They don't really know what is going on.

It looks like more people need to do more reading.

horkn wrote: Now, anyone blindly using rotella or any diesel oil because it was once thought it was ok to use in gas is sadly the most ignorant by far.

Tom, did you even read the thread you linked to? If you did, you would have noticed that every oil needs to be evaluated independantly- there are even variations between grades (weights) of the same brand/type. I do not believe any testing was done on straight weights- so to dismiss Rotella (30w and 40w) is not fair- its only the blend (15w40) that have the reduced levels, as most diesel oils have, due to the new particulate emmisions requirements being placed on them.

Since no one has linked to it in this thread, here is the datasheet for VR1. Notice the zinc/phos content (.14/.13 %, aka 1400/1300 ppm).

Valvoline VR1 data sheet

The lower zinc/phos levels of VR1 samples coming from Blackstone are somewhat troubling, I have to admit. That and the recent price increases (its approaching $5/qt now in my area) will have me checking the shelves for M1 15w50 in the near future.

Here is the chart for Mobil 1 oils.

I'm not trying to get involved I have always used Mobil 1 15W-50 not for the price but by choice.

By the way... Not all marketing guys are technical idiots relentlessly focused at taking advantage of anyone willing to believe the lies they spin about the products they rep. Some of us marketing villains actually are hired by companies because of technical experience and aptitude, and tasked with building product knowledge, customer trust, brand loyalty, and ensure the products that we "rep" are worthy of that respect. Some of us do have integrity and can R&R and know all of the ins & outs of all of the products we are trying to trick you into buying.

Please excuse the side bar and lets get back to arguing about oil..... I'll be on the lake, scheming up my next plot against the helpless consumer.

RJ wrote: Here is the chart for Mobil 1 oils. I'm not trying to get involved I have always used Mobil 1 15W-50 not for the price but by choice. By the way... Not all marketing guys are technical idiots relentlessly focused at taking advantage of anyone willing to believe the lies they spin about the products they rep. Some of us marketing villains actually are hired by companies because of technical experience and aptitude, and tasked with building product knowledge, customer trust, brand loyalty, and ensure the products that we "rep" are worthy of that respect. Some of us do have integrity and can R&R and know all of the ins & outs of all of the products we are trying to trick you into buying. Please excuse the side bar and lets get back to arguing about oil..... I'll be on the lake, scheming up my next plot against the helpless consumer.

Awesome

Actually the thread showed me an another option, Mobil 1 15w-50 as another option.

xjglen wrote: Aren't we supposed to be running straight 40 weight. I have chosen to run a multi-weight 15w-40 but is 15w-50 OK?

I like the wording "supposed to". I'm not looking to get wrapped up in a no win debate over what oil we are all "supposed to" be using. It's an informed and hopefully educated individual choice for you to make that you feel confident best statisfies the mechanical requirements for the conditions wherein you will be operating the motor.

The question of what we're "supposed to" use is not one that will be agreed upon by any group of motor heads be it cars, boats, or bikes.

Here is a great and very appropriate quote for this thread:
"Which is the best grade oil for use in my motor?
Put that question to a group of “knowledgeable” motor heads and the fur will fly. Pronouncements of doom and dire
consequences will abound, usually supported by half truths, urban myths, and anecdotal experiences giving rise to a general
atmosphere of fear, uncertainty, and doubt (FUD). A good understanding of the information presented above will help dispel
much of that FUD and aid you in making a well informed choice. In general you are best served to simply follow the
recommendations of the engine manufacturer. But there are times when that may not be practical or wise. The manufacturer’s
recommendation is based on the assumption that the motor is in new or close to new condition and is being operated in a
typical environment. It is also based on the SAE standards in effect at the time the recommendation is issued. As we’ve seen
the SAE standard has changed tremendously over the last 100 years and tremendous advances in motor oil performance have
been realized. So a 50 or even 25 year old grade recommendation might not be the best choice given current standards and/or
oils. And if your motor is badly worn or operated in unusually harsh or demanding environments that may alter the grade
requirements as well."

Taken from Understanding the SAE Motor Oil Viscosity Standard

So according to the latest SAE J300 standards that I found here (beware this all might be deceitful marketing tactics) 15w40 and and 15w50 have the same high temp viscosity @150 = 3.7. bla bla.

Ive used Mobil 1 15w50 for years it works for me, but may not be right for you. The Mobil 1 marketing hear say is very clever and states "for flat tappet applications". hmmmmmm

No more from me on this one.

eric lavine wrote: there is really no contact between a lifter and a cam, its actuallty a small layer of oil between the 2, its when there is a lack of oil between the 2 is when the problems start

Yes, and this is when the ZDDP comes to play. On a flat tappet, the pressure is so great that high pressure additives in the oil film break down. The zinc then becomes the lubricant saving the metal. The oil guys have not been able to find a additive to replace the properties of the ZDDP yet! I've talked to our oil supplier here at the plant many times about it. You can say that zinc is a lubricant - I see it on a daily basis when we run galvanized without any oil in our stamping dies. Over simplified but the basic principle! Our deep drawing oils have tons of ZDDP it it!!!

BTW, I consider a oil chemist working for a industrial lubricant manufacturer advanced way beyond what's needed in automotive/truck market. The industrial market requires 100's of different lubs and not just a handfull of engine oils and gear lubricants!

So what about putting Lucas in with the oil when changing?

Is this the Lucas product you were referring to?

My buddy had to put in a new cam. Not sure if it was oil related but the oil he used was not on the approved list. Stock motor 700 hours.

I have used Valvoline VR1 in everything from race motors to daily drivers for many years. Run the right viscosity for your use and you should have excellent results. As a comparison, just buy a bottle of 20w50 vr1 and a bottle of Castrol gtx in the same viscosity. Pour them from the bottle and you will see a distinct difference. Unless you are running a full race motor at 6500 plus rpms, the Valvoline oil will be just fine. 50 hours or annual would be a very safe range for oil and filter changes. Just my opinion.

Valvoline racing- Make sure what you use has the large dose of ZINC in it on a Flat tappet Engine. Yes the Gibbs oil has a lot of zinc added to it but very high priced oil. NASCAR engines in the 90's started having issues with lifter failure on flat tappet cams and noticed the oil companies had started removing the ZINC..