I cannot get this engine to run right

MrMcD wrote: http://correctcraftfan.com/forum/uploads/14785/firing.png If this picture is of your engine those are non adjustable rocker arms. You just tighten them down and leave them.

However, you can adjust preload by adding shims if you need.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/fms-m-6529-a302?seid=srese1&cm_mmc=pla-google-_-shopping-_-srese1-_-ford-performance-parts&gclid=CjwKEAjwytLKBRCX547gve7EsE4SJAD3IZV6_pUm97EaBYzOjBWi18PCQkFEC0lzlXhT-VmbZdzyZBoCoiPw_wcB

But yes, they are pedestal rocker arms meaning there is no adjusting beyond shims and new pushrods.

MrMcD wrote: If the photo is you engine those are shaft mounted rocker arm and non adjustable. With these you tighten and leave them.   There is no 3/4 more at that point?

A few rockers had to be shimmed, but they are all right around 3/4 turn. I can twist the pushrods when the valves should be closed meaning there isn't enough pressure on the pushrod to open/hang a valve.

If the photo is you engine those are shaft mounted rocker arm and non adjustable.
With these you tighten and leave them.   There is no 3/4 more at that point?

At this point I would pull the cap off the distributor and bump the key till you rotor points at the number one location. Verify what direction it turns. CW or CCW
Now go to your number one rocker arms, the exhaust and intake rocker should both be up showing both valves are closed and in the fire position.
If you reverse the engine a little the intake valve should start opening.
If you rotate forward a little the intake will close and both valves remain closed on the power stroke.
If you are off you may be 180 degrees out and that is an easy fix just relocating your plug wires or if you choose lift the distributor and rotate it 180.
Verify the basics and it will fre right up.

Your lifter adjustment is perfect for new lifters.
If I read this correctly you installed the used lifters on the used camshaft.
If this was done each lifter should be reinstalled on the exact lifter bore it originally ran in.
If you mixed the lifters up you will need to do a cam breakin on start up.

Installing used lifters takes a different adjustment.
With previously run lifters you tighten them only till you lose up and down play and you are done.
You may have bottomed out a couple lifters hanging valves partially open.
If the engine is running you can back them off while running and adjust them.
It is messy, oil will squirt from the push rods. Special clips are available to help or you can make a splash guard out of cardboard to avoid mess.
I hope you don't need to do this.

TRBenj wrote: That is one option (the correct one), let's confirm that's what was done vs following this diagram.

Here we go again, me and Pete agreeing with each other

Well that's one of the Prestolite modules you have there.

I figure you mean that with #1 at TDC on the compression stroke you're seeing where the rotor is pointing and that terminal is your #1

KooK wrote: TRBenj: I am determining cylinder 1 visually by lining the cap up with the rotor, and sending that wire to cylinder one and going from there.

I don't understand. What are you lining the cap and rotor up to? Please elaborate.

There is a gap adjustment on that dizzy. It needs to be .010 inch between reluctor & pickup. You are supposed to use a brass feeler gage. Just FYI.

Where in Iowa are you located?

Also you talk about your lifter adjustment, do you have an adjustable valve train or is it the stock Ford setup that's non adjustable.?

Your description of valve adjustment makes it sound like it's adjustable because it sounds like the description for adjusting Chevy valves, not Ford which aren't adjustable without going to aftermarket parts, shims etc.

edit after reading your description a few times it sounds good as far ar the lifter adjustment.

KooK wrote: I couldn't wait for the morning, I went and verified, it is 1 3 7 2 6 5 4 8 going CCW. According to the manual I have a 351 camshaft, but according to my valve cover which clearly states "Model 4V 302 Commander" that is the stock 302 firing order. So, my firing order is correct. I verified this with the camshaft (valve covers off, rotating engine).

You seem to be saying that you have a reverse rotation engine with the later 302 firing order which is the same as a 351.

If that's the case why are you saying you verified the correct firing order to be 1 3 7 2 6 5 4 8 going CCW.

I'll put it in all caps.......... THAT"S A NORMAL ROTATION FIRING ORDER. like TRB mentioned

Looking at the time of your post, I figure you're tired and need to look at things again this morning

You want the order to be 1 8 4 5 6 2 7 3 going CCW around the cap if you have a reverse rotation engine

And.........your rotor should be spinning CCW when the engine is cranking.

13726548 is a standard rotation firing order. The boat would have had a reverse rotation engine in it originally with the 18456273 FO. How are you determining where to put plug wire #1 on the cap?

Have you positively verified you have spark at all 8cyl? If not, that would indicate the EI kit is giving you problems and not triggering all the time. Possible bad electronics, possible magnet or spacing issues. Tough to troubleshoot without knowing the brand. Sadly, most people throw out the points plate and cam when converting, making it impossible to convert back (a new distributor may be in your future).

For future reference if anybody digs this up in a search, here is the firing order difference between the 302 and 351.

The valvetrain was set with an old school method. When the pushrod is no longer able to move up/down between the lifter and rocker, make sure the wrench turns less than 1 full turn before it's tight. Shim the rocker if it goes too far. All rockers are set to about 3/4 turn. Make sure the pushrod spins with the rocker tightened down, this will let you know if there is pressure being applied to the valve (giving you a hanging valve). All this is simply to set the preload.

Also, we're a little beyond using the moly vs assembly lube at the moment, I understand what you're saying though.

It should be the factory cam, I'm not sure if the engine was ever opened prior to me getting it, I can tell the oil pan was resealed at least, but beyond that it all looked like factory internals. The camshaft and valvetrain never left my shop as the block/heads/rods/pistons went to the machine shop.

I followed the firing order as listed below.

Using the same cam takes some guesswork away but not all. We know this cam works when properly timed to this engine, your 302.
The cam sprocket could be 180 degrees off to the crank sprocket.
With the valve covers off this could be checked easy. With them on checking will get tricky.
A compression check will tell you if the cam is timed correctly to the camshaft IF the lifters are adjusted properly.
I helped a friend get his 302 running. When I got there it was all messed up and would not start. I checked compression and it was very low.
I asked questions and found out the guy had never before adjusted hydraulic lifters and had them all cranked down till the valves were hung open.
Unfortunately by the time I was called in he had already drained the battery trying to start the engine. He had already wiped a couple cam lobes so after we got it started a couple lifters would adjust to be quiet and then start tapping a minute later. Classic sign of the cam going flat.   I installed a new cam and lifters and it now purrs.
I hope yours does not have this issue. How did you adjust your used lifters?

As Dreaming pointed out the cam if not factory could have the 302 fire order or the 351W fire order, they do differ. You need to know what cam you installed.
Many performance cams use the 351W fire order.

I'm not a fan of moly lube on assembly. You want to use assembly lube. Moly lube can actually repel oil on start up where assembly lube mixes well with Oil on start up so you don't have a transition from one to the other.
Sealed Power makes a quality assembly lube. Part # LL-5. It meets the OE manufacturers qualifications for assembly lube. GM, Ford, Chrysler, Mercedes, BMW, International, Detroit, Cummins Etc. Companies that build thousands of engines demand a quality assembly lube I follow their lead. I think Comp Cams sells a good assembly lube also.

Also an older Nautique will be reverse rotation. Make sure the fire order is set up based on the direction your distributor rotates.
Did you replace the starter? We have seen guys install a standard rotation starter in a reverse rotation engine. They won't start in reverse.
I hope your issue is simple and a quick fix, these are just some more ideas to rule out.
Mark