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1969 Barracuda project

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Roachie View Drop Down
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    Posted: October-28-2008 at 7:57pm
OK, I've spent the last several months lurking the archives here for info on where to start restoring my 1969 Barracuda. My Dad has owned the boat since about 1990, and it's been in his garage since '02. Based on my Dad's description of his last trip out, I'm pretty sure the 318 needs a complete rebuild. Based on what I've read here, I've resigned myself to the fact the stringers need replacing (a job I would not attempt without the information available here, and only here). Those two jobs are my goals for this winter. I'm leaving the cosmetics for next year.

In praparing to dig in to this mess I've read every thread I could find on the stringer job. I know I have to support the underside of the hull (off the trailer) and pull the engine, but I have two questions:

1) I've found several threads on jacks/supports/braces for replacing stringers, most discuss three points of support stern port, stern starboard, and front keel. However, all pics I've found have four supports with two at the front. Which way is best?

2) Where's the best point to attach the hoist to lift out the 318?

Thanks to all of you for you're knowledge. I can't wait for my Dad to hear that unmistakable sound.

Joe Roach
"Beer is proof God loves us and wants us to be happy" Benjamin Franklin
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Riley View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-28-2008 at 8:22pm
Welcome! The Barracuda is a great boat and well worth the effort. I'm just finishing my floor after much procrastinating. I am not a carpenter, but the job was very doable. All you got to have is time and patience, and occational support from fellow members on CCF.

The engine should have lifting rings. I used a board bolted to 2 trees and a come along. Other members can guide you on the support for the hull. I did everything but the main stringers, so I didn't have to do that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote critter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-28-2008 at 11:07pm
Welcome Joe,
I have just replaced the Primary and Secondary stingers in my 66 Barracuda. I left my hull on the trailer, made sure that the Stingers were level (started level, should end level) and braced all 4 corners. I then removed the 2 Secondary stringers and installed the new wood. I then removed a single Primary stinger at a time and replaced. This made me feel better about the hull remaining stiff while I worked inside the hull. It probably took longer as I had to grind away the old glass and clean the boat with each stringer replacement.

I am now getting ready to install the new longitudal stringers. Lots more to do.

As for the motor, that 318 is heavy. Lots of cast parts. I manufactured lift rings that I attached to the front of one head and the rear of the other. Then used a chain and my motor hoist to remove. Had to remove a wheel and lower the axle to the ground to get the motor over the side without having to remove the oil pan. Made it with 1/2 inch to spare.

Good luck with your 69 and keep us posted.
I will put this topic on my watch list as I would like to follow closely.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-29-2008 at 10:57am
Joe,
How about some pictures?

The 60's hulls were quite thick and I really don't feel you need to worry very much about hull distortion. On the trailer is fine or the 3 point method. In later years, the hulls got thinner and relied more and more on the stringer system/foam to maintain the hulls shape. Doing one stringer at a time is really a good method. Besides keeping the basic shape, it also gives you excellent reference points for checking locations and dimensions.


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77 Tique

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-29-2008 at 1:17pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Joe,
How about some pictures?

The 60's hulls were quite thick and I really don't feel you need to worry very much about hull distortion. On the trailer is fine or the 3 point method. In later years, the hulls got thinner and relied more and more on the stringer system/foam to maintain the hulls shape. Doing one stringer at a time is really a good method. Besides keeping the basic shape, it also gives you excellent reference points for checking locations and dimensions.

I agree with Pete 100%. When I replaced one small stringer in my '90, the hull would oilcan a bit if you stepped on it. That was not the case at all with my Tique- that little hull is solid.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roachie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-29-2008 at 3:09pm
Thanks for the inputs. Photos to come tonight.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roachie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-30-2008 at 1:38am
Here are some pics of my '69 Barracuda. I took it off the trailer this evening. I figure that sould make it easier getting the engine out. I'm not really sure what's original and what's not. I'm pretty sure the original color was not brown, but some type of green. The thin brown paint on the hull chips easily which I don't think would happen with a gel coat. The base boards in the interior were painted brown, but had some green on the underside of the fabric. I know the starboard exhaust manifold is not original; my Dad replaced it in the mid '90s.

Before...


Does anyone know what colors the '69 was originally available in? That may get my wife a little more interested.


Already started the fun stuff...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-30-2008 at 9:32am
Originally posted by Roachie Roachie wrote:


Does anyone know what colors the '69 was originally available in? That may get my wife a little more interested.


If you haven't already, spend some time looking through the 68 brochure in the ref. section. We don't have the 69 but I don't think the colors changed or were added onto until 70. This will give you a idea of what the interior is supposed to look like. Then you can go to the diaries and look at the 69 Cuda's. You should be able to spot the originals over the non. Interior colors didn't necessarily match the hull colors. I've seen some rear "off" combinations like your brown with a blue hull. I really don't think CC had a staff of interior designers back then. It was more like Billy Bob grabbing a roll of vinyl they had on hand!! Get your wife going on looking at the pictures. She'll do a much better job and hopefully enjoy getting involved. If you find a picture you (and your wife) like, post it and we'll be able to tell your if it is original or has been done originally.

A hard item to find will be the flooring used. It is actually commercial grade vinyl wall covering. Lots of it is available on line but I've never been able to get close to a match by looking at the on line samples. Go into a wall paper shop with a sample and see what they say.

When you get to the upholstery, you will not be able to do the fake heat stamped pleating/paneling done originally on the seat backs and bottoms. Have the upholsterer stitch it in by stiching the vinyl skin to a 1/4" sheet of foam backing. He'll know how to do it.

Now the fun work starts - foam and stringer work!!! BTW, I'm one for not refoaming under the floor.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October-30-2008 at 12:25pm
Originally posted by Roachie Roachie wrote:

I'm pretty sure the original color was not brown, but some type of green. The thin brown paint on the hull chips easily which I don't think would happen with a gel coat.

Youre probably right- paint will peel off and gel wont. Is there green gel underneath the brown? If I were you, Id be stripping off the paint to see what kind of condition its in.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roachie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-01-2008 at 10:26pm
Pulled the engine and about 4 garbage bags of wet foam today. I started looking for douglas fir for the stringers, but nobody in the Montgomery area carries it. That's just one more reason I hate Alabama and can't wait to move.

Is there an alternative to douglas fir to use when replacing stringers?

As for the foam/no foam decision... Does the foam have any floor support, acoustic, or vibration mitigation qualities to it?





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SNobsessed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-01-2008 at 10:35pm
[QUOTE=Roachie]

As for the foam/no foam decision... Does the foam have any floor support, acoustic, or vibration mitigation qualities to it?


Be prepared for about 4 different answers!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Lake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-02-2008 at 3:28am
Welcome to the site; good to see the little guy getting his hands on this project. Thanks for the pictures, we are all boat voyeurs.

Chuck
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-02-2008 at 9:22am
Joe,
On your question on foam or no foam - No on a 60's hull.

Keep looking for the Doug fir.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote storm34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-03-2008 at 3:16am
Looks like a great project! I agree with TRBenji- see what the original gel looks like, cant beat a Green Machine!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote korey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-03-2008 at 8:00pm
Good looking 'cuda! I brought a '70 'cuda back from the dead this summer, and am loving every second of it. keep those photos coming!
Korey Morris

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 75 Tique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-04-2008 at 7:06pm
Originally posted by storm34 storm34 wrote:

I agree with TRBenj...Can't beat a Green Machine!


Tim's last green machine. (no joke, it really is)






That bit of humor aside, looks like a great project...good luck with it.

I too like the father son aspect of it. Always enjoy it when I have the engine cover up and my son walks by and starts asking questions. How many kids know anything about internal combustion engines any more. Certainly can't point out the basic stuff on new car engines.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-04-2008 at 7:51pm
That Freeport may not have been my favorite boat, Larry- but I really did like the color! Id love to have a Mustang in the same combo.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 75 Tique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-05-2008 at 1:04am
Originally posted by TRBenj TRBenj wrote:

... but I really did like the color! Id love to have a Mustang in the same combo.


Agreed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-05-2008 at 11:02am
There have been a few dedicated threads on foam plus a good discussion somewhere in the pumpkin patch.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roachie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-10-2008 at 12:50am
This is all new to me. I tore the engine down this week to see what I'm up against. Looks like #3 is bad. I'm working to get this to the point I can get it in to the machine shop this week. I hope they can help.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-10-2008 at 9:03pm
Joe,

Meant to give you props for the visual on your motor cart. I needed to slap on together late last week real quick and used yours as a guideline

thanks!
Mike
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote critter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-10-2008 at 11:14pm
Sounds like things are moving right along.
When you take the block and heads to the machine shop, make sure that you tell them that it is a marine reverse rotation engine.

Also may want to tell them about EGGE as they will have the intake and exhaust valves you will need. They will also have pistons if needed. My machine shop said they looked for 2 weeks when I called for a status update. Gave them Egge's 1-800 number and they called me back in 10 mins to say the parts were on the way... Thanks to Reid for this site.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-11-2008 at 10:13am
by the look of the engine cradle, we may have another OCD' er,
my vote, no foam
nice job your doing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roachie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-12-2008 at 10:29am
No OCD here. Just too cheap to buy a proper engine stand. I think I'll need one though when it comes time to pick the engine up and reassemble it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sanity Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-17-2008 at 1:51pm
I am still battling with the foam/no foam issue myself. I say no foam and JB says foam. I think he's more worried about my safety and the effect it would have on me if God forbid anything should happen to the mustang when it's completed. Have time to toss this around so I will keep watching this thread.

BTW, the boat that the excavator is picking up...looks like something I would bring home.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-17-2008 at 2:06pm
Originally posted by sanity sanity wrote:

BTW, the boat that the excavator is picking up...looks like something I would bring home.

Hmmm... it looks like something I did bring home.

If the only issue regarding the foam vs. no foam decision is floatation/safety, consider packing the cavities between the hull and floor with pool noodles. I think I will be going this route on my next restore.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sanity Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-17-2008 at 2:17pm
I saw that in one of your other postings and suggested that to him. He thought I was teasing.

That should take care of "both" of our issues regarding the foam. Solved!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-17-2008 at 2:25pm
I really like the noodle idea too. Sounds silly, but I like it.
Cheap, easy, floats, and doesn't absorb.
I need to find some blue ones for the Mustang.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-17-2008 at 2:35pm
It could easily be my memory, but maybe some have changed their opinion on foam? Maybe some of the older threads on this are worth a re-read?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sanity Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-17-2008 at 2:51pm
Originally posted by BuffaloBFN BuffaloBFN wrote:

It could easily be my memory, but maybe some have changed their opinion on foam? Maybe some of the older threads on this are worth a re-read?


LOL...if that is in reference to me - heck, I've already gone from painting the boat to keeping it original. :)

For a first boat project... I'm not doing so bad. and I'll keep everyone in suspense.

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