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water behind a stringer

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8122pbrainard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-14-2008 at 8:34am
Originally posted by WakeSlayer WakeSlayer wrote:

I have some delamination on the main stringers, The wood is damp underneath, but no glaring signs of rot. I have been up an down both stringers with a hammer and they sound solid. They are, however, somewhat discolored in spots. The parts that have been exposed for a couple days look noticeably better than when initially opened up.


Mike,
Don't take the chance. They are wet, discolored and the spores/fungus are just waiting to be sealed up creating the perfect environment to start up.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-14-2008 at 3:51pm
Pete,
I do get what you are saying, but they are just solid front to back. Does soaking down with CPES not prevent this from escalating to some high degree? There are even portions that are not discolored. I read posts that guys sister stuff up when partially rotted, partially replace sections, etc. And, where the stringers are simply mush, or gone. That is not the case on mine. Not saying I won't replace, but I am most definitely resisting hard.
I am replacing my secondaries, as they split horizontally a little from prying on them, and my longitudinals, which are in ok shape, but easy to do.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-14-2008 at 4:15pm
Mike,
All I'm really saying is I wouldn't take the chance. Yes, the CPES would seal them (must be compleatly dry plus a coat of regular epoxy) but in order to do that, they must be removed from the boat. By the time you do that, you may as well put in new wood. Removal is needed to get all the edges. A example that comes to mind using the CPES in only one area is to reinforce engine mount lag bolts. I've seen the results of pouring CPES down the holes. Works for a couple years only to find the surrounding wood where the epoxy didn't saturate the wood nothing but rot. Remember water can be sealed into the wood too. Fiberglassing the bottom of a wood boat is also a good example. Works for awhile too but accelerates rot from the inside out.

You would be saving the time to cut and fit the wood only. Yes, there are some man hours there! If you do save the old, borrow or buy a decent moisture meter. You want a max. of 8%.

Sistering or scabbing on wood is not my idea of boat repair.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-14-2008 at 4:28pm


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-14-2008 at 7:13pm
No question I appreciate all the knowledge and advice. I had just expected far worse before I opened up.
I am not sure which direction I will go here. I have a few factors weighting what I will do. I still have some work to do before I make that decision.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-16-2008 at 1:45am
I spent a few hours on the Ponyboat today. Got all the old glass out that was at all loose. I left some up in the bow, but it is all tight. Took the grinder with a diamond cutoff wheel and got it done is about 1/4 the time I expected. No kiddin Joe, that was amazing. Cleaned a lot of stuff up with the flap disk after that. It was sunny and windy out today, so I could be outside and not have all the nasty dust in my shop. Whew.
After some cleanup, I removed the shaft and rudder, as I had a little trouble with enough space to do the socket trick on the coupling last weekend. My prop was a bit of a pain to remove, I think the PO had the key jammed way up the propshaft. I had to crank it all the way off.
I feel my stingers look great. I will post pics later, my wife has the camera away for a chicky weekend.
I need to stop here as I have to take my cutoff wheel out for a couple glasses of wine and a nice dinner. She deserves it.

More later.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-16-2008 at 12:34pm
another good tool for glassing operations is a portable hand planer, I use it alot when doing a transom job and it works great for skimming the wood down to the gel, if you need a good flat surface it will also cut through glass.
on certain stringer jobs i will skin the top layer of glass and remove the wood or whats left of it, then simply slip my new wood in making sure that there is resin to hold it, then re-glass over the existing and also building on the old glass with new. trying to keep the "factory seal". On the drains its a good idea to use 4" or 5" pieces of PVC pipe for drains. if you use corner holes they have a tendency to clog
"the things you own will start to own you"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-17-2008 at 7:44pm
When you are saying 4" or 5" pieces you mean in stringer drains? or just front to back? I would like small drains from the outer chambers to the bilge. Any suggestions if that wasn't one?
I am not sure I am putting a battery drain in because I am moving my battery to the center as far forward to the kickboard as I can. It will be raised off the hull sitting on a glassed in block.
I am going to use PVC with a 22.5* angle for my steering cable and wire harness. The glass air tube is still intact from the vent. It is in perfect shape except for the one little hole on the top from having a go with the pitchfork. Totally stupid, but no big deal. It will be interesting replacing the board that that and the new PVC will go through at the front of the bilge.
I have a just a little more grinding to do this weekend as I am out of town the rest of the week on biz. I will have a fan on the boat for a few days while gone.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuffaloBFN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-18-2008 at 7:33am
Originally posted by WakeSlayer WakeSlayer wrote:

I will have a fan on the boat for a few days while gone.


Will there be anybody around to look in on the fan? A friend of mine burned his house down when the fan he was drying his camper with tipped over.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-18-2008 at 8:59am
Is there any reason to use pvc or flexable hose conduit for the wiring harness and cables if you're not going to refoam? The new boats have their cables laying in the bildge and the wiring attached to the stringer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-18-2008 at 9:13am
Originally posted by Riley Riley wrote:

Is there any reason to use pvc or flexable hose conduit for the wiring harness and cables if you're not going to refoam?


Bruce,
No reason to use the PVC without the foam.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-18-2008 at 9:44am
Pete, that's what I thought. Mine is still intact, but I've been thinking about cuttting it out when I detail the bilge.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-18-2008 at 3:31pm
my son will be monitoring the fan. He is going to turn up the heat and turn on a halogen while he works out, then turn off. I will also be calling and reminding him. For that exact reason.
Hmm. I thought it was a good idea to just run the stuff thru a tube like before. Perhaps I won't. Thought i was all smart for using pvc. My previous one was shot. full of gunk and partly shredded. It would make it a bit easier I guess.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-22-2008 at 1:29pm
4' or 5' inch pieces in the corner with small holes drilled around the circumfrence in case the ends clog the water still has a route to exit. same concept as drainage pipe that you use in the back yard
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-22-2008 at 2:30pm
I like that idea, Eric.   Forgive me if this is a stupid question, but are you referring front to back? or from the outer chambers to the bilge. Ot both?   I would like to see a pic of the drain any of you guys have done. Pete, I know you have talked about this, too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-22-2008 at 2:38pm
anywhere you think water will damn up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-03-2008 at 2:08pm
I have been working on the secondary stringers, longitudinal boards, bulkhead, and pylon support. Got them all cut out and epoxied last weekend. Dry fit everything last night, and all seems to fit good. I will be cleaning up the inside, sanding the points of the hull where the new glass will tab to this week, and hopefully installing the new secondaries, etc this weekend.
I have elected to leave the primaries, as they are solid with only minimum damage at the motor mount holes. I have filled these in while hot with epoxy and will re-drill for my new motor mounts in different places anyway. They will be bolted in from the top down, and form the inside out.
I am really happy with the project so far, and it is going better than I expected. Having never worked with epoxy before, I must say I love West System's stuff. Pretty much makes it bulletproof. The metering pumps are a must have. I only made one hot batch, and that was the first one where I made a bit too much. Holy crap does that get hot all of a sudden.
I would still like to see a pic or two of how the drain holes are run through the stringers if anyone has them handy.

Mike
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-03-2008 at 6:54pm
Mike,
This is the only picture I have of my Tique. You can see the bottom notches in the bulkheads pretty well and a couple in the stringers. Just like Eric mentioned, you need to take a look finding the lowest point in any cavity and locate the drain there. Keep in mine that when the boat sits level on the lift, trailer or hanging from the eyes, the bilge drain will be the lowest point.

Don't forget to epoxy/glass any cutouts you do!



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-03-2008 at 8:05pm
Cool. Thank you. Just wanted to get a visual.
I noticed you left the foam in the bow. I kind of wish I had done that too. In the end it was all dry anyway.
I am also going to use little glassed on blocks just like that for under my longitudinal boards as I am not refoaming and am putting a ply floor in. I cut them longer than the originals and beveled them to follow the hull.

thanks again Pete.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-07-2008 at 5:47pm
I put in my secondaries yesterday. It went pretty well. I did both at once, and that was a mistake. Being the first time I have done this, I had a couple issues. Qty of epoxy I made up was one, and timing was the other. Towards finishing it was going off and I was not quite done smoothing the glue to the stringers.
In the future I would do the seperately.
I also removed the hose over the shaft log. This was a bit of a pita as it was glassed in pretty good from the factory.
I will be laying up the main stringers next weekend.
I had my welder neighbor over and he is making me trunnions for my trans mounts, and mounting plates to put the actual trans mounts on.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-07-2008 at 6:43pm
Mike,
I don't know if you have caught this before but it has been mentioned. With large quantities of epoxy, pour the mixed batch into a roller pan. It spreads it out dissipating the heat and will increase the pot life. Use one of the plastic pans and the next day when curred, the epoxy will "pop" off the pan. Also, mix smaller batches. With the pumps, it's so easy to just make more.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-07-2008 at 7:37pm
Yeah, I have read that. I was mixing up peanut butter, and being unsure of the amount i would need, I mixed up a batch of about what would be 12-14 oz in a plastic cup. Then I filled the empty caulking tubes that West sells.
It probably has more to do with not having any experience doing this, and trying to do too much at once. Lesson learned.
As far as making small batches, I have been doing that the whole time coating boards, filling holes, etc. Super easy to make more.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-23-2008 at 1:09pm
I finished laying up my stringers last night. Was not that bad of a job. Some parts sucked, but went mostly smooth.

Next up: drain holes in stringers, move steering cable block, make battery box, fair out bilge and paint.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-23-2008 at 1:15pm
why are you relocating the clamp block?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-23-2008 at 1:23pm
I have a new steering cable that I got from CC last spring. Prior to starting this project, I had installed it and my rudder did not have equal throw and return as what I believe to be the original cable. The support tube was set all the way aft and I could not get the cable far enough out to make an even swing. The way I figure it, the support tube needs to go about 1.5 inches further to the rear to compensate for this. I spoke to CC about this and they also suggested moving the block back. Seems stupid but I cannot figure another way to do this. If I move it back about 2.5 inches, this will give me the room to move the support tube either direction to adjust my rudder for even turning ability both directions. Now is the time to move it since I do not yet have a floor made.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-23-2008 at 1:24pm
Anyone order a new steering cable for a 60's Mustang lately. My son called a reputable CC dealer hoping to get me one for Christmas and was told he would also need a new clamp block and the price would be about $400.

Does that seem right?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-23-2008 at 1:40pm
I ordered mine from Bruce at the former MWCC.
I have a receipt somewhere. As I recall the cable was pretty brutal. Then, after fishing it through, it became obvious that I had to order a support tube, as well.
I do not get why you would need a new clamp block.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-23-2008 at 2:03pm
thought you reused the support tube from the old cable. don't see why you would need a new clamp block unless the OD of the cable changed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WakeSlayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-23-2008 at 2:18pm
The support tube is part of the old cable, it does not come off.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SNobsessed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-23-2008 at 11:39pm
The support tube came off on mine.   But if you throw it away with the old cable before you realize you needed to reuse it, they cost $18.
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