Hellroaring Battery Isolator / Combiners |
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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Has anyone had any experience with any of the Hellroaring Battery Isolator / Combiners?
I'm getting ready to do some stereo upgrades and install a second battery (Optima Blue Top). I want it set up so that the Stereo is running off of the Optima and the starting battery is isolated from the stereo equipment while the engine is off. I'm thinking about ordering the BIC-95150A set up like this: ![]() -Where would be the best location to install one of these? should I try to keep it close to the starter? -I think I'm going to try to install the second battery behind the kick panel under the helm along with a 5 channel amp. The starting battery will be left in the back of the boat. any thoughts or suggestions? |
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78nautique78 ![]() Groupie ![]() Joined: November-10-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 51 |
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A perko switch is 30 or 40 bucks at overtons. It's a battery selector switch.
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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78....
I'm familiar with the Perko switch setup and I don't want to go that route. I don't want to have to remember to switch the switch all the time. I like this type of device since it operates fully automagicly. ![]() |
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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I can't believe no one has seen or used one of these...
Anyway, I ordered one and got it last week and have started to think about how I am going to mount and wire it. The guy I talked to at Hellroaring said that it would be best to mount it as close to the starter as possible I think I want to mount it to the aluminum under the engine cover. I'm not sure if this is a good idea or not. if it is a suitable location, what type of screws should I use to mount it? I took some pics showing the size and where I want to place it... |
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8122pbrainard ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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RiO, I'd worry about drilling the holes in the glass more than what screws to use to mount it. I've never had much luck drilling glass even with the special drill bits. ![]() Seriously, The location on the aluminum (grounded) and vertical for air flow through the heat sink looks good. I would use some self tapping stainless 8-32's |
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Bremsen ![]() Senior Member ![]() Joined: June-26-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 171 |
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I have heard good things about the Hellroaring. I went with the Yandina; basically the same concept. So far its worked very well.
I would suggest installing a perko along with the combiner. Just leave it in the 1 position for automatic charging/isolating, but you still have the option to switch over to the stereo battery if needed. I had a draw on my starting battery early in the season and was glad I was able to switch over to the bluetop to get the boat started. |
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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Thanks for the response.
I will pick up some stainless 8-32's and mount it on the aluminum. Bremsen, I am planning on installing the remote switch and remote LED option. this is supposed to allow switching to the aux. battery if needed, to start. Mike from Hellroaring explained that it may take about 10-15 minutes to transfer enough power from the aux. battery to the starting battery to start but would save the trouble of jumping or moving the battery's in an emergency situation. they sell this remote kit but all it is is a 3 way on-off-on switch and a remote LED, I am able to buy this stuff pretty cheap at the local electronics part store. my plan is to mount the switch/LED in the kickpanel... |
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M3Fan ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: October-22-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3185 |
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I'd be worried about that mounting location in the event that the bilge fills to capacity, e.g. during a rainstorm without a cover, etc.
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2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel
2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
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Bremsen ![]() Senior Member ![]() Joined: June-26-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 171 |
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Randy, mine has that same remote option, though I didn't opt to use it. Problem I found with the remote is that you can't select batt 2 by itself, you can only combine in an emergency.
Here is the problem scenario: The starting battery is dead. Click, click. Voltage on Batt 2 is low (you've been on the sandbar for a couple hours) but could still start the boat on its own. You combine the two with the remote switch, the voltage equalizes between the banks and neither battery has enough voltage to start the boat. Thats why I suggest the perko. |
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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Good point Joel, was not really thinking of that... but, on the other hand, when the boat is not being used it is stored in the garage. Besides if the water would get that high in the bilge I would also have a wet starter and starting batttery which is in the back of the bilge. the isolator/combiner is supposed to be waterproof and looks like it is sealed, so I doubt it would be damaged even if under water. |
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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Bremsen, That makes sense. I see what your saying but, I'm not sure how you would wire in the Perko.
Wouldn't combining two half dead batteries be better than one half dead battery? |
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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BTW, can anyone tell me how many amps my stock alternator will put out?
Edit: the alternator puts out 51A, found it printed on the back of the alternator. |
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Bremsen ![]() Senior Member ![]() Joined: June-26-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 171 |
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Randy, since the voltage will equalize between the two when you combine, you would be S-O-L. Their method is fine if you have a true backup battery (that doesn't have any current draw) but, IMO, if you are drawing off both batteries then the perko is a better option. I might be taking things to the extreme, but thats just how I am.
Here is an example of how to wire up a perko with a combiner. ![]() I am a bit surprised that they would wire the combiner so that the house battery is charged before the starting battery. The suggested wiring on my combiner is to charge the starting battery first and then the house. |
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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Bremsen,
The Hellroaring combiner is not wired so that the house battery is charged before the starting battery. Once the engine is running both batteries are being charged. At least this is what the guy from hellroaring told me. The more I think about this... as long as everything is run to the aux/house battery including the amp, head unit, lights, bilge pumps , etc. There will not be any drain on the starting battery. Then, the only way you would have a problem starting the engine, is if there is a problem with the connection to the starting battery. And you could always swap the starting battery with the aux battery if the starting battery had a problem. I think I will go ahead and wire the remote switch and LED simply because if the starting battery is weak from sitting for a while I could always draw off of the aux to give it a boost. The LED is supposed to provide diagnostic information. |
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TRBenj ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21141 |
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Will you be completely rewiring the stock electrical system? Because all accessories (minus the stereo of course) would still be wired directly to the starting battery in the simplest scenario. (Hence, the benefit of the Perko switch.) |
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79nautique ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: January-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 7872 |
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well are you going to seal the connections once you run the wires and they are connected to the post way down low in the bilge. And I don't see how mounting it where you are in the postion you show is going to make it higher than the starter as the start can see a little water and still operate, the isolator can't, because as soon has the water hits those stud terminals it will short across them and burn everything up in the process and then now how are you going to start the boat to run the bilge and empty the water. What about the time when you forget to install the drain plug, how about the packing flax going out on you, there tons of unforseen scenerio's where water can and will get up to those lower connections and not touch the starter and you dead in the water with no means to remove the water entering the boat. But by then it's to late to say I should have mounted it here instead of where I did. |
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Bremsen ![]() Senior Member ![]() Joined: June-26-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 171 |
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No problem Randy...just a suggestion. Best of luck with the install.
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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Tim, I am thinking about moving the lights and definitely the head unit over to the aux battery maybe some other things as well, I am going to look at it this weekend and see how much work it will be.
As far as placement of the combiner/isolator, I will take a look this weekend and see if I can find a better place to mount it. I'm thinking there may be someplace in the back I could mount it, Maybe I can find space for the second battery near the fuel tank. I want to keep the cable length down as much as possible. |
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79nautique ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: January-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 7872 |
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just get some nylon bolts and nuts and mount it right to the side of the battery box for the second battery.
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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Bremsen, You were right, the BIC will charge the Aux. battery before the starting battery, if set up like the diagram shown in the first post.
After you mentioned that and I started looking at it... it all started to make sense. I called and talked to Mike from Hellroaring. Mike is a great guy and has been very helpful with this project. I explained what I was trying to do and he told me that I should be using the basic auxiliary isolation method. This setup will isolate the Aux. battery from the starting battery when the engine is off and, once the engine is running , will charge the starting battery first and then switch on at 13.4V and combine the batteries so that both are connected to the alternator. Here is a diagram: ![]() Thanks Ryan for bringing this up. |
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akabulla ![]() Gold Member ![]() ![]() Joined: November-15-2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 649 |
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Randy did you ever set this up and how well did it work?
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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aka,
yes, I did get this set up and it worked out great! I have two Optima blue top batteries with the Hellroaring unit isolating the starting battery when the engine is off. I no longer worry about running the battery dead while floating around with the stereo on. I highly recommend this product. |
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akabulla ![]() Gold Member ![]() ![]() Joined: November-15-2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 649 |
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Cool thanks Randy! I am going to go that route. Can you tell me the models of your blue tops? Thanks!
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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I think I got the hellroaring model BIC-95150B. I'll double check later after I'm home.
The Optima Blue top batteries only come in one model... Remember to read everything carefully, you must be sure to use the correct length and gage of wire or you will fry your alternator. Mike at hellroaring was very helpful when I needed help setting it up. |
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TRBenj ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21141 |
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Im pretty sure they come in 3 flavors. 34M is a starting batt, D34M and D31M are both dual purpose in different case sizes. |
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akabulla ![]() Gold Member ![]() ![]() Joined: November-15-2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 649 |
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Joe said he had two of the D34Ms in his boat. I thought the D stood for deep cycle but maybe it stands for Dual? I guess I will start with the starter battery until I get the stereo in and then add the Deep cycle. I am building my own battery box so I can make room for both of them when I am ready to add the second.
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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Tim, you may be right.... I got mine at Sams club, they only had the one size in the Blue top. It is a dual purpose.
The picture on the website shows two different sizes, mine is the smaller one... Optima |
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akabulla ![]() Gold Member ![]() ![]() Joined: November-15-2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 649 |
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Sorry Randy I am confused then. You don't have two optimas? One starting battery and one deep cycle? Do you have two of the same or do you have one optima and one different battery all together?
I didn't know they carried them at Sams! That's good to know. I will go check them out tomorrow! Later! |
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Randy_in_Ohio ![]() Platinum Member ![]() ![]() Joined: September-13-2006 Location: N. Canton, OH. Status: Offline Points: 1891 |
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I have two Optima Blue Tops. I started out with one Optima Blue as the Aux and one two year old Advanced Auto brand automotive battery. I decided to get rid of the generic battery a couple weeks after getting everything set up. There is nothing wrong with running two different type of battery with the isolator, I just wanted to have two good, fresh batteries.
The Optima Blue that I have are both dual purpose (deep cycle/starting) I picked them up at Sam's for about $150 each. I'm pretty happy with this set up, I have cranked my 5 channel amp for hours and then turned the key and had plenty of power. I also installed a switch and LED in the kick panel, the LED give you diagnostic feedback and I can flip the switch and combine the two batteries in an emergency. |
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TRBenj ![]() Grand Poobah ![]() ![]() Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21141 |
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All the technical info is on Optima's website. |
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