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Poor Man's GT40 Diagnosis

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote broden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-27-2018 at 12:16pm
I downloaded your spreadsheet on the GT-40.
I have a 1994 Hydrodyne grand sport, it has the GT-40 pro boss, great engine.
These Nautique forum's are the best place I can find about the GT-40 and the Hot start problem.
I've had the boat about 20 years, maybe the last 7 it's had the hot start problem.
I've tried a few things on the spreadsheet before and will try to go through the rest and hopefully get it fixed.
Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-10-2018 at 8:45am
A few things for you

First you really should start your own thread instead of tacking on to this one. This one is supposed to be for listing solutions. Cut and paste this into a new thread

Second It sounds like you made things worse (but more consistent) with your kill switch replacement, Why don't you bypass it temporarily with a jumper wire and see how things act

Here's a thread in the link down below with lots of info that won't all pertain to your problem but it's informative. His problem was the ECM, hopefully yours is easier and cheaper.

There's a GT 40 service manual in the reference section that you may or may not know about.

You mention both fuel pump relays being replaced. It's really one ECM relay and one relay for the fuel pumps, but you can find this in the manual It takes 2 good ones for the engine to run, it sounds like you have that covered with 2 new ones that didn't help your problem

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chicoman88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-10-2018 at 1:54am
I bought a 98' Ski Nautique this year that had not been used much in recent years. The seller had it de-winterized before putting it up for sale and said it ran great (of course). I got it and the second time I had it out it died on me after it had been run for a while and warmed up. Then I started it back up and it immediately died. Started it again, it did its initial up-rev and died again. Then on the 3rd or 4th time it started and kept running like normal.
I thought maybe it was bad fuel from sitting for quite some time and not being used much, so I topped it off with new fuel and added sea foam for the next trip out. It went without incident.
A couple weeks later we were headed out again and backed down the ramp to launch and the boat would start, do its rev-up and then immediately die. Repeat about 6 times.
It finally started and ran like normal so we headed across the lake to our spot (about a 5-10 minute drive). About 100 yards away from the beach it cuts out and dies. Then I re-start it, it starts, revs up and immediately dies. Repeat 6 or 8 times. Then it starts and runs like a champ until the end of the day, when the cycle repeats again.
The problem is sporadic and impossible to duplicate. So far I've replaced both fuel relays and the fuel filter but couldn't get out before the weather turned to see if that fixed it. Both fuel pumps seem to be running fine as you can hear them fine when you turn the key. I'm pretty confident it's not the kill switch.
Another notable trait is that it seems to rev higher and longer than it should upon initial start-up, and takes a while to come back down to normal running rpm. I'm not sure if that's related or not. I know the GT-40's, and most others, do rev a bit on start up, but it seems higher and longer than normal.
Other options I'm checking into further are the anti siphon valve and the idle air control
Update:
I went to get my boat ready for summer today after it was winterized. I replaced the emergency kill switch today just in case it was an issue too. Put new belts on and went to start it up and... it started and revved up for a second and turned itself back off. After repeating that several times it would not stay running. It starts, revs for a second and shuts itself off. I replaced the battery terminals and put a new connection on the wire coming off the positive terminal, as I’’d heard that was a common problem (called the stay run wire or something like that). Still no luck, it continues to start and then shut itself off. I checked the fuel pressure, it’s at 40 when it pressures up and goes to 45 when it fires and then goes back to 40.
Seems like maybe the computer is shutting it off. It doesn’t have a crank position sensor.
Any other suggestions?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blamey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-22-2018 at 12:35am
Originally posted by roymiz roymiz wrote:

No start (OK, it'd start 1 out of 50 tries) caused by bad cell in the battery.
Even when jumped off another battery, the bad primary battery (only have a cranking battery in my boat) was wreaking havoc on the fuel delivery in some way.

Thought for sure, it was fuel pump/relay related...

Nonetheless, worth sharing. thanks..


Got any more details, this may be my issue. Low battery, jumped off another battery. Cranks but doesn't start.
96 Super Sport
Previously: 95 Sport Nautique, 1980 Ski Supreme
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roymiz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-18-2018 at 11:51am
No start (OK, it'd start 1 out of 50 tries) caused by bad cell in the battery.
Even when jumped off another battery, the bad primary battery (only have a cranking battery in my boat) was wreaking havoc on the fuel delivery in some way.

Thought for sure, it was fuel pump/relay related...

Nonetheless, worth sharing...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-21-2017 at 2:14pm
Ok, I updated the spreadsheet.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-21-2017 at 12:18am
Originally posted by Bri892001 Bri892001 wrote:

No start condition solved by cleaning/repairing engine 10 way harness as described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=42231&PN=1&title=diagnosing-no-start-gt40

I added in the No Start column and created a new row
Corroded 10 Way
Engine Electrical Harness


Updated Spreadsheet


That 10 way connector is really an 8 way connector and it seems like putting something in the spreadsheet about the manual being wrong in reference to the connector would be a good idea too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-20-2017 at 11:23pm
No start condition solved by cleaning/repairing engine 10 way harness as described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=42231&PN=1&title=diagnosing-no-start-gt40

Edited:
I added in the No Start column and created a new row
Corroded 10 (or 8?) Way
Engine Electrical Harness


Updated Spreadsheet
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-30-2017 at 2:18pm
I never got around to logging this one. Intermittent loss of power at speed fixed by replacing distributor. The base problem was a loose/dislodged PIP Hall Effect Sensor.
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41558&PID=538985#538985

I logged it under the
Distributor Complete Rebuilt Row
and split between the Hesitation and Reduced Top Speed Columns

Updated Spreadsheet
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-20-2017 at 12:15pm
Engine surging solved by properly installing the correct spark plugs as described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41778&PID=537476#537476

Logged in Rolling Idle column on Full Ignition Tuneup row.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-20-2017 at 12:09pm
No power in gear fixed by replacing faulty fuel injectors as described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41742&PID=537812#537812

Logged in the Hesitation column in the Fuel Injectors row on the spreadsheet
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17VemuIOaa9i8kEply-ZmFOSyjyzz8rd7B0WEuIT_6S0/edit?usp=sharing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-17-2017 at 11:08am
Ok, I'll amend my post and the spreadsheet.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fgroce Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-16-2017 at 6:09pm
On the skip on acceleration the plugs were Platinum and looked brand new, I really think the module fixed the problem. Just my opinion.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-16-2017 at 1:27pm
Skip/hesitation on acceleration solved by replacing spark plugs and TFI module Edit; TFI module was the fix as mentioned below as described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41734&title=gt-40-slight-skip-on-acceleration

I logged in the spreadsheet (same link as above) under the hesitation column. I attributed half to spark plugs and half to TFI module. Edit: Logged just under TFI
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-16-2017 at 1:18pm
Lack of power after overheat fixed by replacing fouled/damaged spark plugs as discussed here:

http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41631&title=need-some-gt40-help-gents


Logged on spreadsheet in broken spark plug row and split in the columns for Hesitation and Reduced Top Speed:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17VemuIOaa9i8kEply-ZmFOSyjyzz8rd7B0WEuIT_6S0/edit?usp=sharing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-01-2017 at 11:41pm
Bogging under full throttle solved by replacing anti-siphon valve and braided fuel line between Low Pressure Fuel Pump and FCC.
As described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41488&title=2001-gt40-bogging-under-full-throttle

Updated spreadsheet under "Reduced Top Speed" column. Gave half credit to anti-siphon and braided fuel line:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17VemuIOaa9i8kEply-ZmFOSyjyzz8rd7B0WEuIT_6S0/edit?usp=sharing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-21-2017 at 6:53pm
Low RPM misfire fixed by replacing broken/damaged spark plug as described here:

http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=40837&PID=526898#526898

Added broken spark plug rows to spreadsheet. Same spreadsheet link.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-21-2017 at 6:47pm
A second/separate issue solved in the same thread as above.

Replacing a low pressure fuel pump solves a hot restart issue as described in this specific post by by mtguy:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41292&PID=531631#531631

Spreadsheet Updated:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17VemuIOaa9i8kEply-ZmFOSyjyzz8rd7B0WEuIT_6S0/edit?usp=sharing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-20-2017 at 1:31pm
Fuel Pump (FCC) not priming because of loose battery connections.

As described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41292&title=fcc-issue-where-to-start

I added a new row in the spreadsheet for:
Tightened Loose
Battery Connections

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-12-2017 at 5:19pm
Brent, what symptoms are you trying to remedy with the MAP sensor, also what have you tried to fix said symptoms. I haven't seen that particular part come up in the time I've been paying attention, but that doesn't mean it never has.

If you start a fresh thread with GT-40 somewhere in the title, you'll get a good amount of GT-40s weighing in. Hopefully a solution will be found and I can post it back here and add it to the spreadsheet.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lewy2001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-11-2017 at 10:05pm
The MAP sensor on the GT40 is shown in picture below just above the ACT with the vacuum line running to it. Look through all the google images that the search found, you will find one that looks the same.

If you're going through hell, keep going

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<a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote workky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-11-2017 at 1:39pm
Originally posted by lewy2001 lewy2001 wrote:

Ford-AA5Z-9F479 Map Sensor base number is 9F479 the prefix varies with revisions.

I google that PN, my map looks nothing like that, it's more of a rectangular box with a hose nipple on it.
Has anyone here replaced there MAP sensor

I did not see it on the spreadsheet, just curious of symptoms

Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-16-2017 at 5:35pm
Unclogging clogged fuel pickup screen, solves runs&dies fuel starve problem as discussed here: http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=40597&title=98-gt40-rpms-drop-when-engine-warms-up

Updated Spreadsheet added in Clogged Fuel Pickup Row, Runs and Dies Fuel Starve Column: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17VemuIOaa9i8kEply-ZmFOSyjyzz8rd7B0WEuIT_6S0/edit?usp=sharing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lewy2001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January-24-2017 at 9:56pm
Ford-AA5Z-9F479 Map Sensor base number is 9F479 the prefix varies with revisions.
If you're going through hell, keep going

89 Ski

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote workky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January-24-2017 at 4:19pm
Anyone have a motorcraft part number for the MAP sensor, i did not see it int he spreadsheet, surely somebody has replaced it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kylake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-06-2016 at 3:12am
GT-40 1998 SNOB warm engine shutting down; problem solved [Low pressure fuel pump]

As in other postings, my Nautique would start when cold and run great until the engine hit regular operating temperature (160 degrees). Then it drops to idle rough for 30 seconds or so and shut down (sometimes with a backfire). Would not re-start. After reading postings here, I replaced the easiest suspected part first: idle speed control valve. Test drove and got up to temp and it shut down again resulting in a 100-yard paddle back to the dock. Installed a new low pressure fuel pump. No problems during the test drive plus a 20-minute in neutral idle at the dock. Issue seems to be fixed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-18-2016 at 8:59pm
Baffle Broken Loose, restricting muffler and causing reduced performance and slow acceleration.

Fix was to repair muffler.

http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=38572&title=gt-40-slow-acceleration

I updated the spreadsheet and added a new row for the broken muffler. I logged it under the reduced top speed column:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17VemuIOaa9i8kEply-ZmFOSyjyzz8rd7B0WEuIT_6S0/edit?usp=sharing

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-02-2016 at 6:48pm
Replacing Fuel Pressure Regulator solves poor idle and eventual stalling.

Ruptured FP Regulator diaphram was allowing gas to leak into vacuum lines.

http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=39282&title=1997-gt40-efi-poor-idle-eventually-shut-off

Column added to spreadsheet for poor idle and stalling. Spreadsheet same link as above.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-26-2016 at 9:46am
Fuel pumps not running = engine not running. Fixed by replacing ECM (ECA is the correct terminology as explained by Paul, AKA the engine computer) Relay. This is one of the two relays in the back of the motor. One of which is for the fuel pumps and one of which is for the ECA:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=39443&title=gt40-fuelpumps-not-running

Updated Spreadsheet:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17VemuIOaa9i8kEply-ZmFOSyjyzz8rd7B0WEuIT_6S0/edit?usp=sharing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-21-2016 at 9:10am
Replacing Idle Air Control fixes loping idle. This post also comes with an updated part number: http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=39377&title=gt40-isc

Updated Spreadsheet:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17VemuIOaa9i8kEply-ZmFOSyjyzz8rd7B0WEuIT_6S0/edit?usp=sharing
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