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1977 Ski Nautique Rebuild

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8122pbrainard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-06-2013 at 8:24pm
Allen,
It sure looks great and it's great to hear it runs.

Did you notice any issues with the front seal surface on the crank when you had it torn down? Ether way, I agree with Chris on the speedi-sleeve.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-07-2013 at 1:26am
Pete, I did not notice anything unusual. That doesn't mean it wasn't there tough. I'll check on that speedi-sleeve. Any idea on where to find one and are they rotation specific?

Here is a video of it starting... Engine Starting
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-07-2013 at 8:23am
Allen,
The sleeves are not rotation specific. The front seal isn't like rear seals. A good auto supply like Napa will have them.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-09-2013 at 11:33pm
Finally some nice weather!!!!!

I have finished the floor in the bow. I have installed the exhaust cavities and rough cut the port outboard floor panel. So work is getting done.

Enjoy!!







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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-10-2013 at 1:58am
the sleeve might not be rotation specific, but the front seal is. My Napa has had 2 shots at it so far and they finally gave up. Looks like I'm waiting on parts again unless I get lucky and find one in Austin tomorrow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-10-2013 at 7:56am
Originally posted by TX Foilhead TX Foilhead wrote:

the sleeve might not be rotation specific, but the front seal is. My Napa has had 2 shots at it so far and they finally gave up. Looks like I'm waiting on parts again unless I get lucky and find one in Austin tomorrow.

Is your Napa trying to match the sleeve by the engine/seal location or the actual measured diameter of the seal surface? The last time I went to the Speedi-sleeve site, all the sizes were listed by diameters. I ended up ordering it on line by size.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-10-2013 at 4:50pm
My bad, I'm looking or the original seal and they are rotation specific. It would be easy if there weren't lines at all.


Alan, that's something you might want to check to make sure your problem isn't just the wrong seal. There are fine little lines to wipe the crank and push the oil back into the motor. If the crank is spinning the opposite direction they would push oil out the front.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-10-2013 at 4:52pm
I don't have time right now to look, but I do think there is a "speedi sleeve" type repair that is listed for the actual balancer you have so you don't have to measure and look up the speedi chart as to what size a particular one fits

Here it is--
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 2:26pm
A little update.

I finally got the floor bedded down. Now have to tab and glass the top and tie each piece together. Once that is done I can move to fairing the bilge and then bilge paint. In the mean time I will test fit the engine on the new cradle so I can measure for a new shaft.

What weight of carpet have you guys used in the past and what would you recommend?




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 2:28pm
Originally posted by Gary S Gary S wrote:

I don't have time right now to look, but I do think there is a "speedi sleeve" type repair that is listed for the actual balancer you have so you don't have to measure and look up the speedi chart as to what size a particular one fits

Here it is--


Thanks Gary, I will check this out.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 2:50pm
Allen, looking good! I assume you'll be tying the floor to the stringers as well as the hull walls? Probably not in the area of the front motor mounts though, right?

If youre looking to keep the boat looking as original as possible, then I'd go with the Wave Runner (blue) grass carpet: Marine Carpeting

Its not real thick or plush, but on the plus side, it looks good (original!) and doesnt hold any appreciable amount of water.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 3:20pm
Thanks Tim for the link. Yes I will tab the floor to the hull sides with a couple layers of cloth tape and then with the 1708 on top. The floor will joined to the stringer from where the exhaust cavities start all the way to the back. Hard to tie it in where I cut the acces for the engine mounts. That was the initial plan, but as you know a wise man advised me to make an engine cradle for this boat!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 3:46pm
I like what you did there! Should work great for through bolting a cradle. Now that Ive seen it materialize on your boat, the wheels are spinning on how I'll eventually do it on a similar SN or 16 footer. It can sometimes be really tough to visualize until you have an example to go by.

In addition to tying the floor to the stringers in the rear as you describe, be sure to tie them together here as well:



IIRC, we put 2 layers of glass tape at all the floor/hull and floor/stringer seams, followed by a layer of mat (biax would substitute nicely as well). We put 2 layers of tape at all of the floor panel seams (panel to panel). One layer of glass on the underside of the panels prior to install (more where the front seats mount). On top, we did a layer of cloth followed by mat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 4:02pm
Tim, very similar plan here. I plan on using 2" and 4" tape everywhere the floor meets the hull and 4" on all the seems. The floor will get glassed to the stringers and that one spot you circled with 8" tape wrapping down the stringer. Then the entire floor will get 1708 wrapping up the hull side 6" or so, depending on how it works out. Then the plan is to cover that with a layer of cloth (not sure about that yet), so damn much resin!!!!

The bottoms of the each floor piece has two layers of cloth, including the 3/4 subfloor where the seats are. There is a layer 1708 in between the subfloor and top floor there. So where the seats are from the bottom up: 2 layers of cloth, 3/4 bluewater 26, layer of 1708, 2 layers of cloth, 1/2 bluewater 20, layer of 1708 and then maybe a top layer of cloth. Sufficient?

I think the engine cradle is going to work well. If you need any additional pictures as it moves forward just let me know.

I'm hoping I can get the engine test fitted soon, waiting some help my engine lift wont go that high, so I can measure that shaft. Skidim said it should be a 50" shaft, but I want to make sure and suck that prop up close like you recommend. It appears from the pictures I took when I got the boat that there is a couple of inches between the strut and prop!!

Thanks again for all your help.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 4:11pm
Allen, sounds like you built up that front floor section pretty beefy! We only have one layer of 3/4" across the whole front seat area with glass on both sides. We did add another layer of 1/2" in the pylon area though. At 1.25" thick, you probably wont even put the screws from the seat frames all the way through- nice!

As always, the more pictures you post, the better!

Agreed on the shaft... 50" sounds like the stock shaft length (end to end) but ARE doesnt measure them that way. Getting the gap between the strut and prop hub down to 1/2" or 3/8" is ideal.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 4:35pm
Tim I thought you added more support under seat on the BFN. Oh well at least I know it stout. The 3/4 goes from the battery box all the way aft past the pylon. You can see it in a couple pictures I posted earlier before I got the sides done.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 4:36pm
I forgot...I'll try to sit the cradle in tonight and take a couple of pictures and then you see it with the floor and cradle.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 4:51pm
Originally posted by HatterBee HatterBee wrote:

Tim I thought you added more support under seat on the BFN. Oh well at least I know it stout. The 3/4 goes from the battery box all the way aft past the pylon. You can see it in a couple pictures I posted earlier before I got the sides done.


We did the same as Joe, in that we used 3/4" B26 under the front seat area (pylon to battery box), and added a bunch of extra biax on the underside right where the seat frames screw down. The rest of the floor is just 1/2" B20. We did add an extra 1/2" B26 in the area of the pylon, which spans between the stringers all the way forward to the rearmost bulkhead (front end of the bilge)... but that was for pylon support rather than the floor.

Prior to setting down our 3/4" piece:



Finished:



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 5:14pm
Oh I gotcha, maybe that's what I saw. I didn't add any 1708 under the 3/4 just between and then there will a layer on top. Hope that will be enough. I thought about adding some aluminum plates under the seat are and just drill and tap the seats down but that would have interfered with some of the supports and bulkheads so I decided against it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 8:59pm
It's always nice to see a great stringer job!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 10:16pm
Well I removed the tranny yesterday so I could refire the engine and see if the rotation would go away. I dont know if its good or bad at least I know the noise is in the tranny. But thats ok because its the only part of the boat that hasnt been rebuilt. Not sure I want to spend the cash to rebuild before a water test though. Its hard to shell out 600-800 bucks when I dont know that it needs it. Also it was supposed to be working fine before. Dont know what I will do yet on this!!

When I had it running, it appeared to me that the damper plate had a slight wobble to it. Its hard to see it in the video but it seems to me it had a little. Check it out and let me know what yall think.

I definitely have to remove the timing cover and fix that seal its gotten a little worse. I also believe there is a vacum leak around the carb.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-17-2013 at 10:32pm
Allen, I assume that's a new damper? If not, make sure you install one.

I don't see the wobble on my phone but if you are something, it could be real. Eric suggested snugging up the damper after the tranny was bolted to the engine. This can be done using a few knuckles going through the starter hole or by drilling a small hole on the bell housing (install a grommet afterwards so it's not unsightly).

Ive never heard a blown tranny make noise... Damper yes, but a failed tranny is usually still quiet in my experience.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-18-2013 at 1:11am
Thanks Tim,

It is a new damper and if there is a wobble it is slight. I will look at it again before I bolt the tranny back up. I could try and loosen it and then tighten through the starter hole. The sound is like maybe there is a bearing somewhere that has a bad spot on it and it just makes womp-womp sound as it rotates to a certain spot. I'm not worried too much about it now that I know its not the engine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-23-2013 at 7:19pm
Started to tab and glass the floor. Was able to get the engine test fitted the other day. Here are some pictures.














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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-23-2013 at 7:30pm
Beautiful workmanship Allen. Good to see your helper still at it too! Really a transformation between page 1 and now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-30-2013 at 6:54pm
Well I just got finished all I can do before I leave for vacation. Got the floor glassed in and the removal panel cut. I also have glassed the underside of the removal panel. Now I'll be gone for a week and a half and then back to the grind!



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TX Foilhead Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-30-2013 at 7:28pm
Very nice, leave a little room around that floor panel if you're doing carpet.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-17-2013 at 9:56am
Well we are getting somewhere. I got the bilge faired out a bit and have put the first 2 of 3 three coats of bilge paint down. 1 more coat this weekend if the weather holds out, then I will start to reassemble her!!!!   

I have a question for the masses though. I have ordered my carpet and hope to start installing soon. However, is there anyone out there that can explain to me how the carpet trim works. I am about to replace the carpet in the '77 I'm rebuilding and I see a lot of talk about the trim. One of the PO's had replaced my carpet and didn't use the trim so I have no reference on how it goes back in. Pictures and/or explanations would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Allen











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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HatterBee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-18-2013 at 4:16pm
Well the rain here has halted my progress on the paint so I decided to tear the engine back down. Not sure if y'all remember the conversation here about the small oil leak I had once I got the '77 running. I pulled the balancer today to get the front seal and found that the balancer has some pitting on it and the seal has a little bad spot on the bottom. I guess I should have caught this before I installed it but I will chock that up to lack of experience. What should I do to clean this balancer and do you think the standard front seal would be ok or will I have to get a custom seal?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SNobsessed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-18-2013 at 5:23pm
Maybe you could try a speedi-sleave to fix the front CS leak.
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