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Ford 351W Rebuild

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brianmax View Drop Down
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    Posted: February-20-2010 at 6:28pm
I am refurbishing my Ski Centurian from the fiberglass up.. Started with new stringers and transome,, now focussing on the engine. It is a 351W HO. Family members accused me of being insane to undertake this project...and they are quite correct, however, it would be a great "told you so" if my new/old boat spanks the pants off them when I'm done. So even though it will cost extra dollars..that I will never get back.. pride is involved here. So the question is.. what suggestions are there for increasing speed/horsepower on a 351W. BTW, the current heads are cracked..no leakage yet but would soon so considering purchasing new heads... Any advice out there?? :-)
1989 Ski Centurion Ford 351W HO
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote davidg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2010 at 7:46pm
Brian....welcome to the site.

It all depends on what your goals and budget are. You can bore your cylinders and go with oversized pistons...usually .030 over if never rebuilt. You can also add GT40-P heads, or maybe even go with aluminum heads, a custom cam,and an aluminum performance intake manifold.

I rebuilt mine last winter, and just stayed with stock heads, stock cam, re-ringed existing pistons. I did not pick up any additional speed, but, I made it more reliable, and stopped a bad rear mainseal oil leak. My goal was not to build a horsepower monster...just a good running, good sounding 351 in which the bilge didn't look like the aftermath of the Exxon Valdez after every use. Again, consider your budget and goals. I am sure others will add their input as well.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luchog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2010 at 8:02pm
If yours is a 351HO you might already have the GT40 heads, see for the casted barrs on the fron of the head or the casting numbers when you take them apart. If they are not, GT40P are the way to go. Is your engine LH or RH?

Most people here boosting their 351s also add an Edelbrock performer aluminium intake manifold and a Comp Cams Camshaft. You may also look for a new CNC propeller to add after the rebuild.

Those are really nice add ons for the buck.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-20-2010 at 8:59pm
Luch, the HO 351w didnt debut until '92. Cam Research is the preferred cam shop for the Fords, not Comp.

Brian, its very easy to add about 80hp over stock to non-HO 351w (240-255hp) for a relatively small sum (~$1500) by upgrading the top end of the engine. Do a search, lots of info on here. Welcome to CCF!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brianmax Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-21-2010 at 12:07am
Very good advice and thank you to all. I am confused by the HO not being available till '92. My understanding was that the HO was defined by the presence of a 4 barrel carb (which mine has). What does define the HO?

I spoke with a dealer/mechanic today. He said that he was not sure about Indmar Fords but PCM Fords had special marine heads, pistons, cams, rockers, etc. Is that true? Just curious if I get a GT40 head, although it would fit, if it would work.

He also said that the distributor had to be marine and not just one for a car due to the humidity. Is that true or just a dealer story?
1989 Ski Centurion Ford 351W HO
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brianmax Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-21-2010 at 12:28am
The casting # on the head is E5AE CA. Not sure if LH or RH yet. Engine was sitting for 3 years so have not rotated it yet.
1989 Ski Centurion Ford 351W HO
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote davidg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-21-2010 at 1:28am
Brian;

To be able to tell if its RR or LR, when you stand behind the engine, which way does it rotate? If to the right, its a righty. If to the left, its a std. automotive rotation engine.

On the distributor, marine units are sealed so the spark cannot get out and cause an explosion in the confined engine box. May be some other differences too, but, I believe thats the main one.

To my knowledge, the heads, and pistons are std. automotive, or more specifically, truck components. I do not believe the std. 351's used in ski boats are marine special units.

The cam is ground more like an RV cam and designed for low end pull (or torque), more like an RV cam, and not a high winding race cam. Of course the cam in a RH engine is made for that rotation.

The GT40-P heads should bolt right up. If they come off of a 5.0 (302) as many of the "P" heads did, you will have to bore the head bolt holes up a little (to 1/2") so they will bolt on the 351.

As it relates to HO, I am not very familiar with them. Some of the other guys I am sure are.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 79nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-22-2010 at 12:49pm
The distributor isn't sealed to make it marine, they use flame arrestors in the vents to prevent spark ignition.

Dist, starter and alternator all have to be marine and have spark prevention features.

Clearances for the pistons and rings are different for the marine vs. auto other than that they are the same parts just need the correct size and gaps.

If they are GT-40 heads they will have bars cast into them on the ends to identify them as gt-40's I believe yours are not based on the casting but Tim will be along soon to verify this.

Most likely your engine is the same as a standard rotation engine CC was unique in that they used reverse rotation. Loook at you prop if the trailing edge to front edge of the prop blade goes to the left it's LH if it goes to the Right it's a RH and a reverse rotation engine. All this is done look from the transom to the bow as your standing behind the boat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kapla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-22-2010 at 6:41pm
spec for the head...E5AE-CA / 67-70CC / 1.78/1.46 302 / 86-86
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 82 Nautique 1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-26-2010 at 8:49pm
Question I do not know the answer to.

I am wanting to put an electronic distributor in a 1988 CC Ski Nautique.

How do I tell if it is a 351W, 351C, 351M. Mallory says there are 2 distributors and I need to konw what one I have.

Thanks

Dennis
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 81nautique Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-26-2010 at 9:19pm
Originally posted by 82 Nautique 1 82 Nautique 1 wrote:

Question I do not know the answer to.

I am wanting to put an electronic distributor in a 1988 CC Ski Nautique.

How do I tell if it is a 351W, 351C, 351M. Mallory says there are 2 distributors and I need to konw what one I have.

Thanks

Dennis


Not an exact answer to your question but you have a 351W, the cleveland motors were out of production in 1974 and the 351 Modified(destroked 400) was never used in a marine application at least not in a correct craft that I know of.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 82 Nautique 1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-26-2010 at 9:33pm
Thanks Alan....

I will order the distributor for the 351 W

Dennis

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luchog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-26-2010 at 9:51pm
keep in mind you'll need the old distributor gear or a new one since you engine is most likely RH rotation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 82 Nautique 1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-27-2010 at 2:57am
Luciano....

Yes I know the dist. is right hand.   Do you know if a prestolite gear and the size of it will fit the Mallory electronic ?

Just the reverse Mallory gear is about $30.00. would be nice if I can use the old gear :)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JoeinNY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-27-2010 at 4:30am
It would be nice but dont under estimate the importance of breaking a gear and cam in together. All the 351w reverse rotation gears I have seen end up being the same, but if you have a choice and can get a new gear I recommend doing so and installing with a good quality assembly lube. 30 dollars is cheap in the grand scheme of things.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 82 Nautique 1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-27-2010 at 11:24am
Joe.

Thanks for the advice. You are right $30.00 more after what I am putting in the boat is not worth a problem I do not need.

I appreciate all the advice on CC Fan.

Dennis
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-28-2010 at 11:30am
and 8.00 more for a good zinc addative...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brianmax Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-28-2010 at 1:19pm
Thank you all for your help and advice. I have found out that I will have the unfortunate situation of having to be unemployed come June. So until I can obtain new employment and quantify how much month will be left over at the end of the money, I am going to have to mothball my 351W project. Hopefully I will be back soon asking my remedial questions. In the meantime I just wanted to say thank you and I am glad that I found this CC Forum resource.
1989 Ski Centurion Ford 351W HO
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eric lavine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-28-2010 at 5:10pm
I'll let you know how much you'll have left over, count on zero
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 82 Nautique 1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-27-2010 at 8:33pm
Guy's

I am ready to install my new Malory electronic distributor.
I understand I need to hook up wires from the distributor as follows:

Three wire hook up, works with stock coil and resistor.
Green wire connects to the negative side of the coil. Red wire connects to the 12 volt side of the ballast resitor (resisted side of ballast goes to the positive side of coil). Brown wire goes to ground.

Does this sound correct ? any other changes to expect ?

Thanks for any responses

Dennis
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 82 Nautique 1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-27-2010 at 8:35pm
Eric,

What do you mean by a goog zink aditive for $8.oo My distributor (reverse rotation) came with the gear.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SNobsessed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-27-2010 at 8:58pm
Dennis - Did your distributor come with directions or a wiring diagram? On some EI systems, you are supposed to eliminate the ballast resistor, as that function is taken care of by the electronics.

Chris ('79) will know the correct installation from memory, I am sure.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 82 Nautique 1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-27-2010 at 11:48pm
Chris,

I purchased from SKIDIM that is where I received the notes I posted from their website. Just curious if somebody else has made the modification to Mallory.

Where in Iowa are you ? I am in Rock Island, Il across from Davenport

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SNobsessed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-28-2010 at 11:17am
Dennis - I am in Cedar Falls, home of the UNI Panthers, who knocked off Kansas last week.

I am from Rock Island originally. My family used to keep boat(s)at Sunset Marina. My brother had the last Kalhke wood houseboat made (steamboat yard that made the famous Quinlan) - that was quite a boat.

I don't get down there much anymore.

Do you ski on the Rock river?

Are you going to go to Green Lake?

I would like to see your boat some day.

On the dizzy hookup, Chris ('79) will give you good guidance, as he is an ignition system designer.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LaurelLakeSkier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-28-2010 at 11:34am
Originally posted by 82 Nautique 1 82 Nautique 1 wrote:

Eric,

What do you mean by a goog zink aditive for $8.oo My distributor (reverse rotation) came with the gear.

Thanks
I think Eric is just making reference to the fact that you want to be sure your oil contains the zinc additive to protect the flat lifters and cam in your 351 Ford.......most of the new oils leave that ingredient out of their mix. If the oil you buy doesn't have the zinc, you could use an additive but most just use VR1 with a high level of zinc already in it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 82 Nautique 1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-28-2010 at 12:03pm
Originally posted by LaurelLakeSkier LaurelLakeSkier wrote:

Originally posted by 82 Nautique 1 82 Nautique 1 wrote:

Eric,


Thanks
I think Eric is just making reference to the fact that you want to be sure your oil contains the zinc additive to protect the flat lifters and cam in your 351 Ford.......most of the new oils leave that ingredient out of their mix. If the oil you buy doesn't have the zinc, you could use an additive but most just use VR1 with a high level of zinc already in it.


Can you expand on the VR1 ?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LaurelLakeSkier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-28-2010 at 12:33pm
There is a lot of discussion here about the use of oil in our older ford 351 engines. If you use the search function and enter valvoline ZR 1, ZDDP, Oil Additive or something similar you'll have a good day's reading ahead of you.

Here's a LInk to get you started.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 82 Nautique 1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-28-2010 at 12:35pm
Yes, I started searching.. Found the Valvoline VR1 Racing oil and others. Also the zink additive for break in period.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 82 Nautique 1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-21-2010 at 10:01pm
1988 rebuild update:

Started up my 351 rebuild today in the driveway with the flush-pro.

What a wonderful sound to hear the engine purr. 20 minute break in, check timing 10 BTDC set idle... wow !!!

On to refinishing the teak wood, install carpet and the new Nautique skins. Pictures to come as I progress.

Dennis
Original Owner " Dennis"

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brianmax Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-23-2010 at 12:37pm
Congratulation! My 351w just went to the machine shop on Friday for honing. Hopefully my fist start will be as successful as yours. With respect to the Teak, I have found that sanding and multiple coats of varnish (saning in between coats) produces a very attractive result versus the petina of unprotected teak. In the end it is personal preference but I could share pictures if you like.
1989 Ski Centurion Ford 351W HO
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