Water in cylinder-will not crank |
Post Reply |
Author | |
jblunceford
Groupie Joined: April-10-2015 Location: Hoover, AL Status: Offline Points: 89 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Posted: August-29-2020 at 4:59pm |
Hello guys, would appreciate feedback on my boat repair issues below.
Recently took my 351, 1986 Martinique to a new mechanic (after having trouble finding anyone who would take boat in for repair). Have had starting/stalling issues past couple seasons. I Installed a new quick fuel carb a couple years ago and boat very well 4 remainder of season and the next. Also shortly after card upgrade, I replaced the original points system (and coil w recommended one) with a pointless Electronic Module. These modifications worked fine and the boat ran well for a season or more with them. However, have had starting/stalling issues again the past two seasons. Back to current mechanic evaluation ... mechanic pulled a plug or two (not sure how many) and found water on one or more plugs,. He gave me a call saying that he suspected a cracked head. I don't think he's trying to gouge me, as he gave me the news with statement that cost to repair (with any other potential motor issues) could approach the value of the boat. However, I'm not sure a crackhead allows water in the cylinders. Been reading post here that crack, rusted, or leaking manifolds or water jackets are potential sources of water in cylinders. I'm in Central Alabama and not experienced super cold winners in recent years. Additionally, I always do a very thorough drain and filling of the block with antifreeze , so I'm doubtful that this is a freeze damage related issue. During another previous stalling and crank fail., a timing adjustment got the boat running again. I had assumed the same this time, or some other distributor or fuel related issue. This most recent time the boat stalled and failed to crank, it ran fine for 30 to 45 minutes running down lake, but then sputtered and stalled. after stalling it would turn over for a while, (with no start) but eventually stopped turning over and seemed to lock up. Does this sound like hydrolock from water and cylinders? Side questions: do older Motors/ distributors commonly develop timing slip issues as they age? Also, How likely is it that the original fuel pump, ie 30 + years old, had failed? Appreciate any thoughts or feedback on the above . Also any suggestions as to how to proceed. I am not sure the mechanic I'm working with it's on the right track. Thanks in advance, Jeff Lunceford Birmingham, Alabama |
|
Jeff in Hoover (Birmingham), AL
1986 CC Martinique Bow Rider 351PCM |
|
SNobsessed
Grand Poobah Joined: October-21-2007 Location: IA Status: Offline Points: 7102 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Old motors can have a stretched timing chain, but that is pretty rare. Your water issue is more likely to be from exhaust manifold. I would have that leak-tested before replacing head. |
|
“Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.”
Ben Franklin |
|
jblunceford
Groupie Joined: April-10-2015 Location: Hoover, AL Status: Offline Points: 89 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Thank you for the feedback. The motor gas about 800 hrs on it if it offers any indication of possible timing chain stretch.
Regarding manifolds, how is a leak test done? Also, if leak test doesn't show water loss, could a cracked head allow water to enter top of cylinders? Jeff |
|
Jeff in Hoover (Birmingham), AL
1986 CC Martinique Bow Rider 351PCM |
|
8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Jeff, For the best test, the manifold is removed and the riser is removed from the manifold. Then a block off plate is bolted to the manifold where the riser was. Water is added to the cooling cavity and then regulated air pressure on the water. Before you go to all that work, remover the risers from the manifolds and take a close look at the gasket surface between the two. It is a pretty common spot for water leakage. If bad, both surfaces can be cleaned up by flat filing and then a new gasket for the reassembly.
|
|
KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10669 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
It would be good to know how many cylinders he found water in, what the cylinder numbers were and how much water. As an example you might say there was water in #2 and 3 and it came gushing out when the engine was turned over with no plugs in it or maybe #4 and 8 had tiny droplets on the spark plug electrodes If it was hydrolocked, you shouldn't have any trouble finding some water and quite a bit of it. Plenty of places that a head can crack and allow water into a cylinder since the combustion chambers are pretty well surrounded by the water jacket. The cracks can be above a valve and be very hard to find unless the head is totally disassembled It doesn't have to be a crack from freezing, but it can be due to high load, an overheat etc. It could also be that you have something easier like a head gasket issue. Not knowing what the mechanic has done, you may have to get it running on a hose to figure things out. Go back to the first sentence and find out that info as a start to figuring this out
|
|
GottaSki
Grand Poobah Joined: April-21-2005 Location: NE CT Status: Offline Points: 3333 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Compression test as well, before its taken too far apart
|
|
"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."
River Rat to Mole |
|
Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Anyone curious besides me on what happened on this thread? http://https://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=49061&KW=&PID=588505&title=looking-4-mechanic-in-alabama#588505
|
|
KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 10669 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
I'm curious why your link "don't work" Here's a link that works I might be mildly curious
|
|
jblunceford
Groupie Joined: April-10-2015 Location: Hoover, AL Status: Offline Points: 89 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Thanks for the additional feedback. I'm currently working with (former) Smith's Marina, now called Pier 41 or something like that, on Lake Tuscaloosa.
I'll pass this information along to them to see if they can evaluate some of these possibilities before removing the head. It does turn out to be the head, are used heads or engines of this era hard to find? I guess location would be key. |
|
Jeff in Hoover (Birmingham), AL
1986 CC Martinique Bow Rider 351PCM |
|
Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Take no offence but just pointing out your "Bizarro World". You didn't take anyone's recommendations on who to take it to for repair so you took it to an outboard/pontoon dealership,and now you want to know where to get parts.
Here is their tag line on their web site, no mention about fixing anything....... Pier 43 on Lake Tuscaloosa is a family owned boat dealership in Northport Alabama. With more than 28 years of boat sales experience (my italics added) you can count on us to help you find the boat of your dreams.We have an extensive inventory of boats at our showrooms. |
|
jblunceford
Groupie Joined: April-10-2015 Location: Hoover, AL Status: Offline Points: 89 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Didn't mean to offend anyone or appear to ignore advice. I did check with Tim White at inboard Solutions in the Montgomery, Alabama area. He is known as the best mechanic on these older boats in Central Alabama and has worked on my boat before. Tim is booked up for the foreseeable future so I took it to this local marina. It just changed hands to new owners and changed names in recent weeks. I knew the prior Smiths marine owners for many years and they had a repair shop for decades. They retained the repair shop. Smiths marine actually did some work several years ago on my prior '83 CC Southwind ( not sure why the new ownership doesn't advertise their repair shop).
I am still looking for a more knowledgeable repair shop in Central Alabama. Most shops in my area won't take a boat this age. I just reached out to Scott in Ga for another shop rec (believe I did several weeks ago and he also recommended Tim Whit in Montgomery). If the current (former Smith's Marina) mechanic can't leak test the manifolds, I'm going to winterize the boat until Tim can take it or I can find another older Correct Craft experienced mechanic. I very much appreciate all the feedback you all have offered. Best, Jeff |
|
Jeff in Hoover (Birmingham), AL
1986 CC Martinique Bow Rider 351PCM |
|
jblunceford
Groupie Joined: April-10-2015 Location: Hoover, AL Status: Offline Points: 89 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Didn't mean to offend anyone or appear to ignore advice. I did check with Tim White at inboard Solutions in the Montgomery, Alabama area. He is known as the best mechanic on these older boats in Central Alabama and has worked on my boat before. Tim is booked up for the foreseeable future so I took it to this local marina. It just changed hands to new owners and changed names in recent weeks. I knew the prior Smiths marine owners for many years and they had a repair shop for decades. They retained the repair shop. Smiths marine actually did some work several years ago on my prior '83 CC Southwind ( not sure why the new ownership doesn't advertise their repair shop).
I am still looking for a more knowledgeable repair shop in Central Alabama. Most shops in my area won't take a boat this age. I just reached out to Scott in Ga for another shop rec (believe I did several weeks ago and he also recommended Tim Whit in Montgomery). If the current (former Smith's Marina) mechanic can't leak test the manifolds, I'm going to winterize the boat until Tim can take it or I can find another older Correct Craft experienced mechanic. I very much appreciate all the feedback you all have offered. Best, Jeff |
|
Jeff in Hoover (Birmingham), AL
1986 CC Martinique Bow Rider 351PCM |
|
jblunceford
Groupie Joined: April-10-2015 Location: Hoover, AL Status: Offline Points: 89 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
By the way, no offense taken.
Appreciate all thoughts & feedback. Jeff |
|
Jeff in Hoover (Birmingham), AL
1986 CC Martinique Bow Rider 351PCM |
|
Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Just be careful you don't want to be paying someone to learn how to work on your boat,you could be doing the learning for free.
|
|
jblunceford
Groupie Joined: April-10-2015 Location: Hoover, AL Status: Offline Points: 89 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Yes, good advice.
|
|
Jeff in Hoover (Birmingham), AL
1986 CC Martinique Bow Rider 351PCM |
|
8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
My same thought.
|
|
Post Reply | |
Tweet
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |