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Relay Starter GT-40

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BobbyG View Drop Down
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    Posted: July-29-2006 at 12:48pm
I have a 98 Sport with a Boss GT-40 EFI that has had multiple maintenance symptoms this year. I have replaced the Fuel Filter, the Impeller and Thermostat and hopefully that will take care of that problem. My boat won't start on a few attempts then suddenly it will start up. I was told the Starter Relay has been notorious for going bad.

Yesterday, I got the new relay from Skidim and proceeded to replace it. I was certain that I was careful on making sure the correct wire will go back on the bolt on the relay but it was such a tight fit that I may have goofed. Now my boat won't even crank. I have checked my 2 batteries and it shows 14 Volts. The radio won't even power on. I checked to see if I was getting voltage from the positive (red) battery wire that connects to the relay and to the starter and its getting 14 volts. I then decided to put my old relay back on to see if the new one was defected and again nothing. I have attached a diagram and a picture showing how I ran the wires. Can any help? Thanks!

Bobby G.
98 Sport Nautique
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 83SN2001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-29-2006 at 8:58pm
Have you checked your ignition breaker and your ignition switch?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BobbyG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-30-2006 at 3:40pm
How would you test the breaker if its bad or not? From my diagram above, does it look like some wites may be crossed up? Thanks!
Bobby G.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 83SN2001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-30-2006 at 9:03pm
On the back side of the breaker, check for voltage on both terminals with the breaker pressed in. Same for your ignition switch. Check for voltage at the on terminal and also the start terminal when the key is in those positions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 77stang Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-31-2006 at 8:01am
i think you may have goofed. you have the heavy gage cable from the battery and the heavy gage cable to the starter hooked on the same terminal. also, at least on my old boat (not to imply it would be the same here) one of my four solinoid terminals is not used.

lets see if someone can get you going in the right direction
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David F Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-31-2006 at 5:04pm
The battery wire and the wire from/to the circuit breaker (50 amp) should be on the same post.

The wire from the nuetral safety switch should be on the "S" terminal.

The heavy red wire from the starter should be on the large post opposite the batter/breaker large red wires.

The "I" terminal should have 12v+ when the key is turned to "run"

Not sure about the other wires.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce R Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-07-2007 at 2:01am
I just replaced the solenoid on my 1996 Ski Nautique 176 (Ford 351 GT-40 310 HP engine). In my case and oddly enough, there were three red wires on one of the large posts. One coming from the battery, one going to the circuit breaker and one going to the starter. This did not look correct but oddly enough is how mine was wired up and still is. Having said this and looking at the sketch of your wiring diagram diagram, you should try moving the one red wire that you labeled "to circuit breaker" and connect it to the same post on the solenoid as the Battery and Starter lead is connected to. Just as a note, I always disconnect the + lead from battery before doing any electrical work, especially in potential high current areas. I was having intermittent starting issues (symptoms - enable ignition switch on dash, turn key and get one click, try again one click, try again starts right up). This issue is no longer occurring after replacing the solenoid.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GottaSki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-07-2007 at 10:39am
Originally posted by 77stang 77stang wrote:

i think you may have goofed. you have the heavy gage cable from the battery and the heavy gage cable to the starter hooked on the same terminal.


77 if he has the permanant magnet starter, then the starter is indeed connected to the battery.
the traditional relay now only activates the high-current solenoid/relay on the starter, not the field/arm current.

The solenoid-relay on the starter then turns itself on, activating the start
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M3Fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-07-2007 at 11:29am
Originally posted by GottaSki GottaSki wrote:

Originally posted by 77stang 77stang wrote:

i think you may have goofed. you have the heavy gage cable from the battery and the heavy gage cable to the starter hooked on the same terminal.


77 if he has the permanant magnet starter, then the starter is indeed connected to the battery.
the traditional relay now only activates the high-current solenoid/relay on the starter, not the field/arm current.

The solenoid-relay on the starter then turns itself on, activating the start


Correct. On the newer style starters, the relay is only activating another relay on the starter via the small wire going to the starter. The big cable to the starter is 100% hot 100% of the time. I can take a look at mine tonight and verify how it's hooked up for you as far as the other cables.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jo-e90 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 1:33am
Did this problem ever get resolved??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jo-e90 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 2:02am
Did you ever look at yours?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 2:05am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jo-e90 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 2:38am
I replaced the starter relay on my GT-40 because the FCC would not always pressurize at start-up so I would have to turn the key to off and then on again and it will always start like a champ.
Now My GT-40 cranks over just fine but does not start.
I have tried- all of the suggested conflicting opposite advice ways- to connect the NEW relay and some ways leave everything dead and others allow the motor to crank but not start.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote malibud Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 11:13am
If the motor is cranking that should be the right way for the solenoid. (in my amateur opinion) . Now you have to look to see if you are getting fuel .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 12:04pm
jo-e90,

1.) Where did you get the solenoid, is it a proper PCM branded? I ask, because the OEM PCM ones use the solenoid body as a ground. Some of the aftermarket ones need a separate ground wire.

2.) Do you remember how it was originally wired? This should be the proper way.

3.) If you don't remember, You want:
-The Red Battery Cable,
-Heavy Red wire from the Starter, and
-the small red wires that go to the main 50A engine breaker
all going to the constant hot big post on the starter solenoid

The smaller yellow red wire from the other big post to the starter.

The wire coming from the Neutral Safety Switch (NSS) goes to the smaller "S" post.

The smaller "I" post, may or may not be used on a GT-40. If it is, it would go to the computer, but we'd have to have a GT-40 guy weigh in on that.

4.) This was most likely not related to your original problem. You probably wanted to replace the small fuel pump relay. There are two of the same, one for the computer and one for the fuel pumps
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 12:52pm
Per page 275 (of the PDF), Diagram 6-1 of the GT-40 Manual, the "I" post is indeed used for computer functions.
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/Downloads/Pro_BOss_GT-40_Service_Manual.pdf

Keep in mind this post only sees voltage during cranking, so you can't have any of the smaller red wires on it that are expecting/needing a constant hot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gun-driver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 1:31pm
Are we sure everyone is talking about the same relays. Did someone tell you to replace that specific relay or could they have meant the relays below the breakers on the back which control the fuel pumps.
Maybe you should jump the pumps and see what you get.

These little buggers


Jumped fuel pumps
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jo-e90 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 2:26pm
The motor ran fine before I installed the starter relay only.
It just took 2 tries with the key once in a while, but I will say that the FCC rumbles every time now with key on with the new starter relay.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gun-driver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 2:34pm
My question is did you check the relays? You replaced the starter solenoid because you weren’t getting fuel pressure it may have been the relays causing the problem not the solenoid.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bakchose Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 4:20pm
Funny how this post has been revived because I'm having issues with starting my 2000 sport with the GT40. The last couple of weekends I've put the battery on the charger due to it not starting. I would just get a click sound. One click per push of the start button. I went got a new battery(the one in the boat was old) and I got the click again. I pushed the button a couple of times and then it started. The volt gage went up to almost 14 but when I ran it a couple of miles the gage slowly dropped to just above 13. I shut down to idle and it went back up to almost 14 (slowly).and stayed there. I also have to mention that at one point, even with the old battery fully charged the key pad didn't work. At all. no horn or blower. I know in lock mode these are suppose to work. I do have to say I got caught in drizzling rain out on the lake and just left the cover off. The boat sat for 10hrs and the pad worked. I got the click again. But after 5 tries it started. That's when I went out to buy the new battery to start the process of elimination. Any thoughts?.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 4:40pm
John,
I guess the first step is just to make sure everything is clean and tight around the area of the engine breaker and the starter solenoid. Especially where you're seeing varying voltage output once the engine is running.

With the clicking, you'd have to test that your getting voltage to the other big post on the relay and that it's going to the starter. Depending on what you find, it could either be the relay, the starter or just loose/dirty connections.

I'll actually be up in NH/Maine this weekend with some free time if you need a hand checking.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bakchose Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-08-2015 at 4:58pm
Hey Brian that would be great if you could stop by. I can't find my voltage meter and the electrical systems aren't my strong suit. I printed out the manual from you above link and holy Ream and a half of paper    . E-mail me when you think you can stop by and let me know what is your preferred beer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jo-e90 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-09-2015 at 1:05am
Originally posted by Bri892001 Bri892001 wrote:

jo-e90,

1.) Where did you get the solenoid, is it a proper PCM branded? I ask, because the OEM PCM ones use the solenoid body as a ground. Some of the aftermarket ones need a separate ground wire.

2.) Do you remember how it was originally wired? This should be the proper way.

3.) If you don't remember, You want:
-The Red Battery Cable,
-Heavy Red wire from the Starter, and
-the small red wires that go to the main 50A engine breaker
all going to the constant hot big post on the starter solenoid

The smaller yellow red wire from the other big post to the starter.

The wire coming from the Neutral Safety Switch (NSS) goes to the smaller "S" post.

The smaller "I" post, may or may not be used on a GT-40. If it is, it would go to the computer, but we'd have to have a GT-40 guy weigh in on that.

4.) This was most likely not related to your original problem. You probably wanted to replace the small fuel pump relay. There are two of the same, one for the computer and one for the fuel pumps


Thanks for the idea but, When I wire it up your way, I get a totally dead boat, so I don't know if it's because I got bought it at an auto parts store that it does not ground like it should or what.

When I wire it up the OP's way, it at least cranks like a champ but does not start up.
1997 Sport Nautique
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lewy2001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-09-2015 at 7:18am
Joe have you checked for spark??

I would take a step back and put the old relay back on and see if your relay is faulty. You could prove it with a VOM if you are proficient enough.

They call that a power assist relay on the GT40 and could not have put it in a more awkward place to get at. I like it's position on Paul's early GT40 it is much easier to access not sure Pete would like all that silicone though
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jo-e90 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-09-2015 at 7:01pm
Getting rid of the EEC fuse seemed to help
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lewy2001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-09-2015 at 10:29pm
Removing the old EEC battery cct is covered in this thread. It was a common intermittent failure on GT40's.

EEC Cct Retrofit
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