Relay Starter GT-40 |
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BobbyG
Newbie Joined: July-09-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6 |
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Posted: July-29-2006 at 12:48pm |
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I have a 98 Sport with a Boss GT-40 EFI that has had multiple maintenance symptoms this year. I have replaced the Fuel Filter, the Impeller and Thermostat and hopefully that will take care of that problem. My boat won't start on a few attempts then suddenly it will start up. I was told the Starter Relay has been notorious for going bad.
Yesterday, I got the new relay from Skidim and proceeded to replace it. I was certain that I was careful on making sure the correct wire will go back on the bolt on the relay but it was such a tight fit that I may have goofed. Now my boat won't even crank. I have checked my 2 batteries and it shows 14 Volts. The radio won't even power on. I checked to see if I was getting voltage from the positive (red) battery wire that connects to the relay and to the starter and its getting 14 volts. I then decided to put my old relay back on to see if the new one was defected and again nothing. I have attached a diagram and a picture showing how I ran the wires. Can any help? Thanks! |
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Bobby G.
98 Sport Nautique |
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83SN2001
Groupie Joined: September-07-2005 Status: Offline Points: 66 |
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Have you checked your ignition breaker and your ignition switch?
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BobbyG
Newbie Joined: July-09-2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 6 |
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How would you test the breaker if its bad or not? From my diagram above, does it look like some wites may be crossed up? Thanks!
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Bobby G.
98 Sport Nautique |
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83SN2001
Groupie Joined: September-07-2005 Status: Offline Points: 66 |
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On the back side of the breaker, check for voltage on both terminals with the breaker pressed in. Same for your ignition switch. Check for voltage at the on terminal and also the start terminal when the key is in those positions.
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77stang
Senior Member Joined: May-19-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 342 |
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i think you may have goofed. you have the heavy gage cable from the battery and the heavy gage cable to the starter hooked on the same terminal. also, at least on my old boat (not to imply it would be the same here) one of my four solinoid terminals is not used.
lets see if someone can get you going in the right direction |
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David F
Platinum Member Joined: June-11-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1770 |
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The battery wire and the wire from/to the circuit breaker (50 amp) should be on the same post.
The wire from the nuetral safety switch should be on the "S" terminal. The heavy red wire from the starter should be on the large post opposite the batter/breaker large red wires. The "I" terminal should have 12v+ when the key is turned to "run" Not sure about the other wires. |
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Bruce R
Newbie Joined: August-06-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 8 |
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I just replaced the solenoid on my 1996 Ski Nautique 176 (Ford 351 GT-40 310 HP engine). In my case and oddly enough, there were three red wires on one of the large posts. One coming from the battery, one going to the circuit breaker and one going to the starter. This did not look correct but oddly enough is how mine was wired up and still is. Having said this and looking at the sketch of your wiring diagram diagram, you should try moving the one red wire that you labeled "to circuit breaker" and connect it to the same post on the solenoid as the Battery and Starter lead is connected to. Just as a note, I always disconnect the + lead from battery before doing any electrical work, especially in potential high current areas. I was having intermittent starting issues (symptoms - enable ignition switch on dash, turn key and get one click, try again one click, try again starts right up). This issue is no longer occurring after replacing the solenoid.
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Bruce R
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GottaSki
Grand Poobah Joined: April-21-2005 Location: NE CT Status: Offline Points: 3327 |
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77 if he has the permanant magnet starter, then the starter is indeed connected to the battery. the traditional relay now only activates the high-current solenoid/relay on the starter, not the field/arm current. The solenoid-relay on the starter then turns itself on, activating the start |
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"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."
River Rat to Mole |
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M3Fan
Grand Poobah Joined: October-22-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3185 |
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Correct. On the newer style starters, the relay is only activating another relay on the starter via the small wire going to the starter. The big cable to the starter is 100% hot 100% of the time. I can take a look at mine tonight and verify how it's hooked up for you as far as the other cables. |
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2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel
2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
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jo-e90
Gold Member Joined: March-16-2011 Location: Midwest Status: Offline Points: 659 |
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Did this problem ever get resolved??
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1997 Sport Nautique
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jo-e90
Gold Member Joined: March-16-2011 Location: Midwest Status: Offline Points: 659 |
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Did you ever look at yours?
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1997 Sport Nautique
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Jonny Quest
Grand Poobah Joined: August-20-2013 Location: Utah--via Texas Status: Offline Points: 2842 |
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From NautiqueParts.com
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Current
2003 Ski Nautique 206 Limited Previous 2001 Ski Nautique Open Bow 1994 Ski Nautique Open Bow Aqua skiing, ergo sum |
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jo-e90
Gold Member Joined: March-16-2011 Location: Midwest Status: Offline Points: 659 |
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I replaced the starter relay on my GT-40 because the FCC would not always pressurize at start-up so I would have to turn the key to off and then on again and it will always start like a champ.
Now My GT-40 cranks over just fine but does not start. I have tried- all of the suggested conflicting opposite advice ways- to connect the NEW relay and some ways leave everything dead and others allow the motor to crank but not start. |
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1997 Sport Nautique
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malibud
Gold Member Joined: July-08-2009 Location: north carolina Status: Offline Points: 605 |
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If the motor is cranking that should be the right way for the solenoid. (in my amateur opinion) . Now you have to look to see if you are getting fuel .
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4945 |
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jo-e90,
1.) Where did you get the solenoid, is it a proper PCM branded? I ask, because the OEM PCM ones use the solenoid body as a ground. Some of the aftermarket ones need a separate ground wire. 2.) Do you remember how it was originally wired? This should be the proper way. 3.) If you don't remember, You want: -The Red Battery Cable, -Heavy Red wire from the Starter, and -the small red wires that go to the main 50A engine breaker all going to the constant hot big post on the starter solenoid The smaller yellow red wire from the other big post to the starter. The wire coming from the Neutral Safety Switch (NSS) goes to the smaller "S" post. The smaller "I" post, may or may not be used on a GT-40. If it is, it would go to the computer, but we'd have to have a GT-40 guy weigh in on that. 4.) This was most likely not related to your original problem. You probably wanted to replace the small fuel pump relay. There are two of the same, one for the computer and one for the fuel pumps |
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4945 |
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Per page 275 (of the PDF), Diagram 6-1 of the GT-40 Manual, the "I" post is indeed used for computer functions.
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/Downloads/Pro_BOss_GT-40_Service_Manual.pdf Keep in mind this post only sees voltage during cranking, so you can't have any of the smaller red wires on it that are expecting/needing a constant hot. |
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gun-driver
Grand Poobah Joined: July-18-2008 Location: Pittsburgh, Pa Status: Offline Points: 4112 |
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jo-e90
Gold Member Joined: March-16-2011 Location: Midwest Status: Offline Points: 659 |
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The motor ran fine before I installed the starter relay only.
It just took 2 tries with the key once in a while, but I will say that the FCC rumbles every time now with key on with the new starter relay. |
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1997 Sport Nautique
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gun-driver
Grand Poobah Joined: July-18-2008 Location: Pittsburgh, Pa Status: Offline Points: 4112 |
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My question is did you check the relays? You replaced the starter solenoid because you weren’t getting fuel pressure it may have been the relays causing the problem not the solenoid.
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Bakchose
Gold Member Joined: November-04-2004 Location: Boston, MA Status: Offline Points: 554 |
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Funny how this post has been revived because I'm having issues with starting my 2000 sport with the GT40. The last couple of weekends I've put the battery on the charger due to it not starting. I would just get a click sound. One click per push of the start button. I went got a new battery(the one in the boat was old) and I got the click again. I pushed the button a couple of times and then it started. The volt gage went up to almost 14 but when I ran it a couple of miles the gage slowly dropped to just above 13. I shut down to idle and it went back up to almost 14 (slowly).and stayed there. I also have to mention that at one point, even with the old battery fully charged the key pad didn't work. At all. no horn or blower. I know in lock mode these are suppose to work. I do have to say I got caught in drizzling rain out on the lake and just left the cover off. The boat sat for 10hrs and the pad worked. I got the click again. But after 5 tries it started. That's when I went out to buy the new battery to start the process of elimination. Any thoughts?.
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Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4945 |
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John,
I guess the first step is just to make sure everything is clean and tight around the area of the engine breaker and the starter solenoid. Especially where you're seeing varying voltage output once the engine is running. With the clicking, you'd have to test that your getting voltage to the other big post on the relay and that it's going to the starter. Depending on what you find, it could either be the relay, the starter or just loose/dirty connections. I'll actually be up in NH/Maine this weekend with some free time if you need a hand checking. |
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Bakchose
Gold Member Joined: November-04-2004 Location: Boston, MA Status: Offline Points: 554 |
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Hey Brian that would be great if you could stop by. I can't find my voltage meter and the electrical systems aren't my strong suit. I printed out the manual from you above link and holy Ream and a half of paper . E-mail me when you think you can stop by and let me know what is your preferred beer.
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jo-e90
Gold Member Joined: March-16-2011 Location: Midwest Status: Offline Points: 659 |
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Thanks for the idea but, When I wire it up your way, I get a totally dead boat, so I don't know if it's because I got bought it at an auto parts store that it does not ground like it should or what. When I wire it up the OP's way, it at least cranks like a champ but does not start up. |
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1997 Sport Nautique
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lewy2001
Grand Poobah Joined: March-19-2008 Location: NSW Australia Status: Offline Points: 2234 |
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Joe have you checked for spark??
I would take a step back and put the old relay back on and see if your relay is faulty. You could prove it with a VOM if you are proficient enough. They call that a power assist relay on the GT40 and could not have put it in a more awkward place to get at. I like it's position on Paul's early GT40 it is much easier to access not sure Pete would like all that silicone though |
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If you're going through hell, keep going
89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
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jo-e90
Gold Member Joined: March-16-2011 Location: Midwest Status: Offline Points: 659 |
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Getting rid of the EEC fuse seemed to help
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1997 Sport Nautique
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lewy2001
Grand Poobah Joined: March-19-2008 Location: NSW Australia Status: Offline Points: 2234 |
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Removing the old EEC battery cct is covered in this thread. It was a common intermittent failure on GT40's.
EEC Cct Retrofit |
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If you're going through hell, keep going
89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
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