Stumbling out of idle |
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Author | |
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Posted: December-14-2014 at 10:00am |
Hey Guys,
My 75 SN has started stumbling out of idle as I am pulling folks off the dock. I have the idle set at about 700 which is perfect for "in gear" maneuvering as I set up to pull 3 or more folks. As I increase the throttle out of idle to pick just a bit more momentum, the engine wants to stumble. If I move the throttle quicker to a higher power, the engine will hesitate slightly, but pulls smoothly. This has just started with the colder water. It is completely livable, but I would like it running 100% Is this an accelerator pump problem? Is it a jet setting issue? do I need to rebuild the carb? Does it sound like a tune up issue? Thanks, Tom |
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Tom, The accelerator pump would be my first guess. A carb rebuild isn't a bad idea as well as a tune up but that does depend on how many hours since the last one. |
|
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Hey Pete,
Its a new to me boat, so I guess it would not be a bad idea to go through it. It is an Osoco marinization. Thanks, Tom |
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Tom,
Do you mean the exhaust manifolds are Osco? |
|
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Yes, is that not who marinized the engine?
|
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Tom,
No, the Osco manifolds are after market so a PO must have replaced them possibly due to running salt water. What else do you know about the engine? |
|
Orlando76
Grand Poobah Joined: May-21-2013 Location: Mount Dora, FL Status: Offline Points: 3108 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
I believe we determined it to be a true Escort engine.
|
|
8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Yup, I just went back into Tom's posts reminding myself about the boat. It's an Escort! |
|
Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4945 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Super Easy, super quick fix is to see if you if all the slack is taken out of your accelerator pump linkage. You don't want even the slightest delay between the start of throttle plate opening and the start of the pump shot.
The only "gotcha" on mine is needing two of the same size open end wrench to hold the bolt and open up the nut (or vice versa). I believe it's 3/8ths on mine. I also had to remove the throttle linkage to get enough clearance for the wrenches. |
|
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Ok Brian, That is the easy fix. I will try that and get a rebuild kit on order. I may as well get points, plugs, wires fuel filter & rotor going as well. Has anyone put a fuel/water separator on an Escort? How about a strainer? How about a flush pro? It looks kind of tight for that plumbing.
|
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4945 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
I don't think anyone here recommends a flush pro for any marinization. I've often heard them criticized as a potential air intrusion point.
A couple other checks on the carb before the full teardown (Of course you may find your igntion tune-up and timing check helps the stumble as well). Make sure your idle mixture screws are dialed in. Also, make sure you're not getting any leaking/dripping around your accelerator pump cover. |
|
8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Tom,
I agree with Brian regarding the Flush Pro. Many here have built there own. Do a search for "Tim's flush system". It may also be in the FAQ thread. |
|
8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Tom,
Here's the thread on the "Tim flush pro" |
|
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Thanks Guys
I will look for the parts. |
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
So I looked at the carb today.
The accelerator pump seems to be squirting immediately. HOWEVER, there is a slight amount of leaking at the throttle shafts, so I assume that would cause a vacuum leak while running. Looks like a rebuild is in order. What do you think of these guys for a quick fix? Which one do I get?National Carb |
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
peter1234
Grand Poobah Joined: February-03-2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2756 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
maybe check your mechanical advance on the distributer too
|
|
former skylark owner now a formula but I cant let this place go
|
|
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
I will Peter. I am ordering the parts right now for the tune up. Here is the carb model. So I found this on ebay Holley Is that the same carb? |
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
GottaSki
Grand Poobah Joined: April-21-2005 Location: NE CT Status: Offline Points: 3327 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Eh, that ebay is crap, its been apart, the transfer tube is hanging and the metering block looks older than the bowls.
Best rebuild what you have. Clean the meting block. set timing to 10 btdc. |
|
"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."
River Rat to Mole |
|
8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Tom,
It's the list # that's important so the one you found on Ebay is not the same. Since the listing states it may be for a 460, I'm say the CFM is greater. |
|
Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4945 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Do you have any video or at least a pic of that leak? |
|
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Hey Brian and Pete,
I will get a pic and post it. It is coming from both sides. What carb do I have? Is it an 80319? What do you think of this for a quick fix? National Carb |
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4945 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
You have a 351, right?
You'd want the 600 cfm version. The top one on that page is for a 302. I don't have any personal experience with National Carb, but it sounds like people have had good luck with them. |
|
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
So, just an update, I did a tune up with the help of Eddie O, and got a new carb from National with a 6.5 power valve. I am about 98.7% happy, but I have the slightest delay under a load like a ballet line. It is not really a stumble anymore, it is almost like a slight delay then massive power. My question is about vacuum and the PVC valve. How many gaskets should be below my carb? I have 2. One has four cutouts for the primarily's and secondary's. The other came with the carb and is just open. Can I just use the new gasket and get rid of the old?
Is the PVC valve marinization specific or over the counter Ford? Tom |
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
phatsat67
Grand Poobah Joined: March-13-2006 Location: Indiana Status: Offline Points: 6147 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
PCV is probably marine specific Tom. Loads and usage is far different on a marine engine.
The lower carburetor gasket (between the spacer and intake) is specific and can not be substituted. The upper doesn't really matter., |
|
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
So I put new gaskets on, and problem solved! No more stumble. Nice clean acceleration.
Thanks Guys! Tom |
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
spiralhelix
Senior Member Joined: August-06-2014 Location: IL/WI Status: Offline Points: 496 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Zach, i am replacing these gaskets as well. So is this order correct: carb, right gasket, spacer, left gasket, engine? (middle gasket unused) The guy that rebuild my carb said the exact opposite to you (carb to spacer is specific and lower can be whichever) and wants me to flip the gasket order from what I have above. Thanks, Spiral |
|
Bri892001
Grand Poobah Joined: September-27-2008 Location: Boston MA Status: Offline Points: 4945 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Spiral, I've always understood that you want two like the one on the left. I'd get the marine thickness ones from Zach.
|
|
peter1234
Grand Poobah Joined: February-03-2008 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2756 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
if you are using an aluminum spacer /wedge and you have an open plenum you have to use the one on the right between the intake and spacer i have always used 2 of those . now if you have the 4 holes on the intake i'm not sure it matters for the bottom one
|
|
former skylark owner now a formula but I cant let this place go
|
|
wataugasn84
Senior Member Joined: January-06-2013 Location: East Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 118 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Tom,
I have been experiencing similar carb problems as you and have had my carb rebuilt 3 times. Runs ok for a while then a different problem. Did you buy a rebuilt carb or a new one, your post said you got a new carb from National then you refer to the guy that rebuilt yours. I just don't know what to do rebuilds haven't turned out very well. |
|
Watuugasn84
|
|
seacamper
Platinum Member Joined: June-24-2010 Location: Florida Status: Offline Points: 1056 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Hey Doug,
I did get the carb from National, and it appears new. They do not take your old carb back. That means for you, you could buy the carb from National, rebuild yours, and have a spare on the shelf for troubleshooting. Do you have a PCM engine? What is the condition of your fuel/water separator? How does your internal filter look? Could you have a vacuum issue like I did? The guy I talked to who "built" my carb, was the guy who installed the 6.5 power valve at National Carb. After finally getting the gaskets on, the carb was awesome. I like the fact that National actually bench tests the carbs before they send them out. For Spiral, yes, the gasket order you describe is what I used. It works great. I am not the expert, so I do not know if it is by the book, but it works great on mine. Tom |
|
1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar
1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
|
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Tweet
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |