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Seat bottom material or "What's it made of?"

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TallTex View Drop Down
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    Posted: February-08-2013 at 3:53pm
What material is the white hard "plastic-foam" looking material that is the base or seat-bottom for the seats? I am trying to figure out best practices for repair. Plastic weld or fiberglass or both to avoid have to replace entire piece. Is this some from of light-weight PVC sheet? Does not seem very dense, hence the break.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SNobsessed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-08-2013 at 9:16pm
HDPE, at least for my driver seat. I don't think any glue will stick to it.

Post a picture, maybe you have something else.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-08-2013 at 10:09pm
Originally posted by SNobsessed SNobsessed wrote:

HDPE, at least for my driver seat. I don't think any glue will stick to it.

Correct that HDPE can't be glued (the reason glue containers are made with it!) but, it can be welded. However, I sure wouldn't spend the time to weld. Just replace the whole piece.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mark c Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-09-2013 at 12:18am
Theres some stuff called pro poly thats made by innerduct for glueing HDPE conduits and couplings together, that will tear the couplings apart before the glue fails. Don't know if it would be acceptable for gluing a seat back together or not, but its one of the only adhesives that will glue HPDE to HPDE. Short of that you need to plastic weld it together using HPDE rods.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-09-2013 at 12:27pm
I don't think cc used hdpe on seat bases. Maybe the rotomolded drivers seat shell (mid 80's forward) but not the bases. I have it on good authority that composite seat bases are xpvc.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TallTex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-09-2013 at 12:59pm
I agree up to now, but TAP plastics poly-weld adhesive will repair or even build HDPE pieces together. You can watch one of their many informative videos on their web site.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TallTex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-09-2013 at 1:05pm
"...Maybe the rotomolded drivers seat shell (mid 80's forward) but not the bases. I have it on good authority that composite seat bases are xpvc."

This on my 1999 SNOB, assumed all CC seats were same after wood was eliminated.
Sorry the X stands for? Thank you for the reply
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-09-2013 at 2:38pm
Yes that is my understanding (all seat bases have been xpvc since wood was eliminated).

X = expanded
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bhectus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-11-2013 at 12:33am
Tim, even the black seat bases in the 80's style deluxe interior SN's? (love seat and stern seat bases). I also thought they were HDPE.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SNobsessed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-11-2013 at 1:35am
Sorry, didn't pickup about bases vs seat bottoms.

I was referring to the driver seat bottom, which is a thick amber plastic on my boat.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TallTex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-11-2013 at 10:18am
For clarification. It is the white plastic sheet material that the seat vinyl is stapled to. Hence the "seat bottom" reference. From earlier posts seems it is expanded polyvinyl chloride or high density polyethylene. I am thinking the XPVC. Both of which can be repaired by plastic welding with the proper rod material and from what I have learned from TAP plastics HDPE can be glued with their poly-weld adhesive after the edges are properly heated with a propane torch. They have many great videos on their website to show HDPE repair and others.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-11-2013 at 12:09pm
The seat "base" is what the foam sits on and the vinyl is stapled to. CC went to composite in '93. Ive been told that its been XPVC ever since. No idea what the rotomolded driver's bucket is made out of, nor the plastic seat frames used on late delux 2001's (or 90+ NWZ rear seats for that matter). Calling those piece "bases" is probably misleading- frame is probably a better term. They did take the place of the aluminum frames used previously, after all.

Chris, now Im confused even more- what piece of your driver's seat is made of thick amber plastic? The base? The rotomolded bucket? The pedestal? The base should be plywood (as was my '90), and the pedestal is gelcoated fiberglass. If your base is plastic, then my bet is that its not original.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote harddock Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-11-2013 at 4:47pm
Would 3M 5200 silicon do the repair?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-11-2013 at 8:31pm
Originally posted by harddock harddock wrote:

Would 3M 5200 silicon do the repair?

Kevin,
5200 is a moisture cure polyurethane!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SNobsessed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-11-2013 at 9:09pm
Tim - I would post a picture of it but the boat is stored 50 miles away.

On mine, you can pull up the front of the driver bottom cushion (the skin is snapped at the rear) & the horizontal support underneath is what I guess to be HDPE.


All my other seat bottoms have plywood in them that the skins are stapled to.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hollywood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-11-2013 at 9:49pm
It's 2013. Pics would really help. The seat "base" threads are always a mess.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote storm34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-12-2013 at 2:50am
No clue what they used but I posted this a few years ago and never got a good answer. From our 96 SNOB's observer seat bottom. It was original for sure since it had all the trimmings like the rest of our seat bottoms.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February-12-2013 at 5:33pm
Chris, Ive been gathering information as of late (mostly from Christine's) about composite seat bases for the '80. Turns out CC has used XPVC (Sintra Board is the specific brand) since they went composite in '93. There are some tricks to working with it, but Im determined to not use ply!

Im sure its the same stuff they used on the trunk floor in the Crush. We have a piece or 2 thats shattered pretty good (held together by the carpet)... maybe from running a bit of weight back there?    It sure doesnt look repairable- at least I wouldnt expect it to hold any weight afterwards. For boards that dont need to hold staples, coosa is probably a better choice. Otherwise, thicknesses should be chosen carefully and strategically placed reinforcements should be added, especially for wider spans.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote audiodude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-14-2013 at 6:23pm
I used polyurethane sheeting to replace some of my plywood seat bottoms. Bought it at HD it is only 1/4 inch so I doubled it up. It was recommended by the guy who did my upholstery who swears by it. Haven't put the seats in the boat yet so I will have to see how it holds up.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TallTex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-14-2013 at 7:53pm
FYI: I am pretty sure after all the input here and my own research, the material is in fact expanded pvc sheet. About .50 inch thick. I found one or two suppliers online that will sell special cuts so you do not have to buy an entire sheet. Interstate Plastics having most any type of synthetic sheet/material made.

However, I ended up dismantling observer's seat bottom and repairing the cracked xpvc-sheet on both sides with "Aero Marine" two-part epoxy resin I have used their epoxy many times repairing boats and other items. If you have any rotten wood you can restore the rot with their resin and wood-dust as a thickener. Old or new wood can be "sealed" with their resin thinned with no more than 10%, by weight or volume, acetone then saturate wood with the mixture and it will encapsulate the wood fibers (penetrating resin) to prevent future rot.

On this job I added a thickener (cabosil)to part-1, to make a paste then added hardener (part-2)and "glued" the two edges together, then used the regular two part resin & fiberglass cloth on both sides (one side at a time)to cover the break. Once cured it was much stronger than original sheet. If it breaks again it will be in another area. Plastic welding was also an option but cost for buying the welding-tool and repair material would have exceed buying an entire new piece of XPVC or other synthetic sheet in the size I needed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-14-2013 at 10:09pm
Originally posted by TallTex TallTex wrote:

I have used their epoxy many times repairing boats and other items. If you have any rotten wood you can restore the rot with their resin and wood-dust as a thickener. Old or new wood can be "sealed" with their resin thinned with no more than 10%, by weight or volume, acetone then saturate wood with the mixture and it will encapsulate the wood fibers (penetrating resin) to prevent future rot.

Monty,
I've been around wood boats as well as wood stringered boats for plenty of years and feel your recommendation of wood rot repair is nothing more that a temporary fix. In fact, I would call it more of a "back yard" fix. Epoxy saturating rot may fix that area but then the wood next to the repair will go. Plus, even faster since now the moisture is sealed in!!!! I've seen it plenty of times. In fact, we even have a member (I will not mention his name) that can contest to the issue. Have you ever tested the moisture content of the surrounding wood? I certainly hope you don't make this type of repair "professionally".


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TallTex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-14-2013 at 10:28pm
Hi, thanks for the reply but your reply goes beyond the subject post.

1. I recommend "Aero Marine" products, I have plenty of experience repair to boats and other things and have found nothing better to work with. Their epoxy resin is non-blushing and Low VOC. That is all I was saying.
2. You are making presumptions/assumptions that go beyond what I stated in my post. It merely stated Aero Marine products if used properly are excellent, including their use for repairs to wood-rot. Nothing was stated on "best practices" or "how to" properly repair wood rot in a boat. This depends on a case by case basis and depends on exactly what it is you are trying to repair.
3. I was not speaking to repair of wood rot in my post.

Regards, Monty
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-14-2013 at 11:09pm
Originally posted by TallTex TallTex wrote:

I was not speaking to repair of wood rot in my post.
Regards, Monty

Sorry as I must have misread your post.
Originally posted by TallTex TallTex wrote:

If you have any rotten wood you can restore the rot with their resin


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