Busted Block |
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gravyleg pirate
Groupie Joined: August-01-2012 Location: Lawrence, KS Status: Offline Points: 61 |
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Posted: April-02-2020 at 11:47pm |
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Not really a question, more of a "holy crap I can't believe this happened". We ripped out the carpet last year and are going to lay down Sea Dek when the weather turned cold and we had to put her in storage for the winter. Got her out last weekend and after cleaning up a couple of things I thought I'd fire her up and see how she sounds. Maybe even hit the lake for a spin even though we don't have carpet, an engine cover or many seats.
Charged the battery, hooked up my garden hose and hit the start button. Heard the engine turn over beautifully with that nice throaty 275hp sound...with something extra. It was water spraying out at a high rate of speed against the wall. Lo and behold, I have a crack. So, what size motor should I put in next? Would be nice to be a part of the corvette crowd! |
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GLP
"If we couldn't laugh we would all go insane" 2000 Air Nautique 216 (for 19 years) 2005 Air Nautique SV211 (2 months and counting...) |
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63 Skier
Grand Poobah Joined: October-06-2006 Location: Concord, NH Status: Offline Points: 4269 |
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Not sure what the easy replacements for the 5.0 would be. I'm sure someone will jump in. Sorry to hear, that really sucks.
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'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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DVskier
Senior Member Joined: September-04-2014 Location: Seneca SC Status: Offline Points: 449 |
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GT-40 would be awesome.
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tryathlete
Platinum Member Joined: April-19-2013 Location: Lake Villa, IL Status: Offline Points: 1797 |
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How bout an ExCal swap? I
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Earl,
Yes, when that happens it does suck. Sorry to hear about the problem. Was the engine winterized? If so, explain how it was done so others may not experience the same. problem. |
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baitkiller
Platinum Member Joined: October-11-2011 Location: SW Florida Status: Offline Points: 1693 |
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Im thinking a 6.2 with the whipple kit should put in the four and half hundred range. Nice little re power.
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Jesus was a bare-footer.............
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63 Skier
Grand Poobah Joined: October-06-2006 Location: Concord, NH Status: Offline Points: 4269 |
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but $$$ |
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'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21182 |
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Would be good to know age and exactly which engine you’ve got to start with... carb vs efi etc. Trying to reuse existing setup to what extent, etc?
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63 Skier
Grand Poobah Joined: October-06-2006 Location: Concord, NH Status: Offline Points: 4269 |
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From his diary it's the 5.0 275 HP GM.
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'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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baitkiller
Platinum Member Joined: October-11-2011 Location: SW Florida Status: Offline Points: 1693 |
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Well crap.. you didnt say there was a budget.
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Jesus was a bare-footer.............
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baitkiller
Platinum Member Joined: October-11-2011 Location: SW Florida Status: Offline Points: 1693 |
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5.7 vortec will give you a noticeable increase in hp and all your stuff will fit. Piece of cake if your carbureted. Not sure what you can or would need to do with injection. There's plenty of guys here that do know though. I went from 5.0 old style carbed to the 5.7 vortec last repower and I must say the boat runs quite nicely.
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Jesus was a bare-footer.............
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63 Skier
Grand Poobah Joined: October-06-2006 Location: Concord, NH Status: Offline Points: 4269 |
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Well since it's not my money, I'd put an Ilmor in it! |
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'63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11087 |
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And from an old thread here's a picture Model Year 2000 Throttle body injected I figure the engine tag starts with PLG but he could verify that
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baitkiller
Platinum Member Joined: October-11-2011 Location: SW Florida Status: Offline Points: 1693 |
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I bought it remanned from Center State Engine. came with pan, wp and intake. They will build anything to your spec and the price was right. Discount on shipping to a shop with fork truck. I also had trouble getting it timed and tuned right and their CS was very helpful.
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Jesus was a bare-footer.............
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Riley
Grand Poobah Joined: January-19-2004 Location: Portland, ME Status: Offline Points: 7953 |
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GM Vortec is the biggest bang for the buck. Great engine..
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gravyleg pirate
Groupie Joined: August-01-2012 Location: Lawrence, KS Status: Offline Points: 61 |
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It is the original 5.0 PCM and I winterized it two years ago. Last summer our lakes were flooded and no one was able to get on the water. That's why the good idea fairy showed up and told us to refurb the interior.
This crack could have happened at any point over the last two years, but we store it in our local caves where it doesn't get colder than 60 degrees. I thought I drained it well enough and dumped in enough RV antifreeze but who knows. What restrictions do I have in replacement engines? Anything that will fit and does it have to be a marine engine? |
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GLP
"If we couldn't laugh we would all go insane" 2000 Air Nautique 216 (for 19 years) 2005 Air Nautique SV211 (2 months and counting...) |
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GottaSki
Grand Poobah Joined: April-21-2005 Location: NE CT Status: Offline Points: 3362 |
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The world is your oyster...
But to speak thoughtfully, we need to understand your restraints and must haves, budget, platform, injection, zero off, brandy-new, this DIY basic, hobbyist/enthusiest or contracted out... etc... |
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"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."
River Rat to Mole |
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gravyleg pirate
Groupie Joined: August-01-2012 Location: Lawrence, KS Status: Offline Points: 61 |
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I'm pretty handy through the power of this forum and Youtube, but would prefer someone install it for me.
I don't even have a ballpark of what a replacement engine would cost to begin with or what I am looking for. As this one is only the 275hp I'd like to find something fuel injected with a bit more power to get my inlaws out of the hole a little better. Something under $5k? |
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GLP
"If we couldn't laugh we would all go insane" 2000 Air Nautique 216 (for 19 years) 2005 Air Nautique SV211 (2 months and counting...) |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21182 |
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I suspect those 4 things won’t go together. Pick any 2, maybe 3 if you’re lucky.
Fuel injected More power Paying for someone to install Under $5k |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11087 |
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I like that thought process Since you already have fuel injection and the bad parts are the block and maybe head(s) why not get a 305 marine long block like what's in the link below Forget about more power and then you've got 2650 bucks left over to spend on transferring parts to the new long block and getting it installed if my 'rithmetic is right. No calibration issues since all the original fuel injection parts are getting reused. Considering turn around time and effort involved it's hard to beat The more you do yourself, the more you save. Otherwise that 5K ain't gonna get you very far link Or go the junkyard engine/block route and transfer parts if you're handy enough |
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1TAZZ
Groupie Joined: February-14-2009 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 95 |
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Do you have water in your oil , if it is just a cracked water jacket you can repair it in the boat using block stitching , Look up lock-n-stitch I have fixed a few cracked car blocks It works great..
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Lake Wylie NC
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41045 |
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Joe, I'm very familiar with the process and personally don't feel stitching is an option. It will never pull the crack tight enough to be water tight. With the closed cooling on a automotive block you typically of add a "stop leak" product. |
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gravyleg pirate
Groupie Joined: August-01-2012 Location: Lawrence, KS Status: Offline Points: 61 |
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So as I start tracking down options, do I need to worry about what will match up with the transmission as a direct drive?
What about the engine mounts? Do I have to find something to fit exactly or is there some leeway? |
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GLP
"If we couldn't laugh we would all go insane" 2000 Air Nautique 216 (for 19 years) 2005 Air Nautique SV211 (2 months and counting...) |
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1TAZZ
Groupie Joined: February-14-2009 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 95 |
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At this point he has nothing to lose , worth a try but it looks like he is ready for a new motor . The new stitching pins pull the block together . The kit is $250 vs $3000 either way it sucks and good luck.
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Lake Wylie NC
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11087 |
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Pete
I think 1TAZZ is pretty familiar with the process too since he works at a machine shop It's hard to tell from the pictures if the crack goes all the way up to the head gasket area on the deck of the block. If GLP was to find a local auto machine shop that does this, he could get an in person opinion. I might be worried that I got the block stitched and 2 weeks later the same thing happens in another spot or internally though. |
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11087 |
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If it was me GLP, I'd be talking to a CC dealer to get all the info you can on the engine.
You might say it wasn't the most popular engine PCM ever made Then if for example you want a long block like what I linked earlier from ATK engines, talk to them to tell them what you have and see if their VMM2 long block is compatible. I would guess that it is but could tell you if they have something else. Everything that bolts to your block now like the exhaust, flywheel, harmonic balancer, bellhousing, starter, damper plate and transmission, ignition system and injection system will swap right onto a same era long block like the ATP one. I'd make sure your manifold is compatible with the heads (it should be) and that the mounting holes at the front of the heads for accessories are the same. A good thing would be to take a valve cover off and verify the casting numbers The referenced engine has a roller cam and yours should too, but it would be good to verify. Let the engine place tell you what you need if in doubt, then at least it's their fault if they get it wrong Lots of things to think about so take your time with the research and if you come up with questions, ask here You can look for a local shop that's comfortable working on your boat too. |
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gravyleg pirate
Groupie Joined: August-01-2012 Location: Lawrence, KS Status: Offline Points: 61 |
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Wow! That's a lot of detail I hadn't planned on. Called our local Nautique dealership and had a good chat. Will call around to a couple other places to see if they can do an engine install if I go with the ATK option.
Dealership did have some good deals on newer ones though.... for a price! Thanks everyone! |
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GLP
"If we couldn't laugh we would all go insane" 2000 Air Nautique 216 (for 19 years) 2005 Air Nautique SV211 (2 months and counting...) |
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MrMcD
Grand Poobah Joined: January-28-2014 Location: Folsom, CA Status: Offline Points: 3748 |
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A 2000 block is a Vortec Design and it is very popular and cheap to rebuild. I see no reason to replace your 305/5.0L with another. A switch to the 350/ 5.7L would be my first choice.
As Ken mentioned most parts will work with both blocks. Since yours is a Vortec design you will need to stay with Vortec heads on the new engine. A vortec engine uses a unique intake manifold and it bolts up differently than the older 350 or 305 engines. I do not know if GM used a specific head for the 305 Vortec engines. If the head is the standard Vortec head and compatible with the 305 and 350 you could just buy a replacement short block and use all your parts to get it running again with a 305 or a 350. The 350 Vortec would be a nice upgrade, probably 35 more horsepower and 30-50 pounds more torque. A short block could be had for around $1000, if you want a Long Block would only be 300-500 more. I think these are reasonable estimates you could probably beat with some shoping. Short BLock = Rebuilt block only, with no heads on it Long Block = Rebuilt block with rebuilt heads and valve train. Find out about Core charges in advance, they may claim your broken block has zero core value and charge as much as $250 core charge or they may sell the short block or long block outright with no core needed but you need to know before you order. Some shops include the Tin on a long block some do not, you need to know before you spend any money. Tin would include, Timing Cover, Oil Pan and Valve Covers. You can use your Tin of course off your used and broken engine but it would need to be cleaned before being used on your new engine. The install is where you will bump into some expensive numbers. I bet a shop will want 10-15 hours to pull your engine, swap parts and put it back in and get it running for you. This should include an actual start up and cam break in, unless they use a roller cam which has been optional since about 1986 in the GM blocks. Roller Camshafts do not need a break in. Shop labor varies around the country from $75-$150 per hour. Do it now while all the shops are slow you might get a good price break and get it back quickly. Mark |
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21182 |
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The issue with going to a 350 from a 305 is the locked EFI tune... it’s highly probable that it wouldn’t play nicely with the larger displacement. If it was carb, it’d be a no brainer. I’d be collecting info on that TBI system to see how flexible it might be.
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KENO
Grand Poobah Joined: June-06-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 11087 |
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Well at least Tim knows why I linked a 305 roller block from ATK and not a 350
And a little reading about the ATK VMM2 let's you know the tin comes with it. And you'll find out too that there's no core charge on their marine stuff and I might as well mention no shipping charge either. Here's the link one more time Like I said there are other outfits, this is just an example of a place I'm familiar with. link |
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