Bad Flywheel? |
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78skinautique
Groupie Joined: July-03-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 71 |
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Posted: August-08-2014 at 5:39pm |
Hey folks, been a long while since I posted here. After a total overhaul in 2005-07, my 1978 Ski Nautuqe (351 Commander) as been running pretty solid for the most part since then, until now. It all began at the start of the spring, I went to start the motor, and after just a few attempts, the starter would clearly engage and spin, but (apparently) no contact was made with the fly wheel because the motor would not turn over, just the starter (spinning). I figured I had blown the teeth of the starter, and needed a rebuild. So I removed the starter and brought it in for a rebuild (First week of July). The guy at the auto-electric store suggested I try a new, less expensive gear reduction starter (100 bucks) instead of having my 3 year old starter rebuilt for 150. I took him up on the suggestion, and the gear reduction starter worked for about 3 weeks, but each time I hit the starter, I heard a little grinding sound for a half of a second after the motor was started, it sounded like the starter was remaining engaged for that extra half second. I figured it wasn't working right, but it was starting the boat for a little while. Eventually, after a few weeks (maybe a dozen or 20 starts), the starter made the same sound, apparently spinning, but not turning the motor over. So I called the guy up at the starter/auto electric store and told him of the grinding sound and that it didn't work any longer, and he was cool enough to rebuild my original starter at no extra cost. That was 2 weeks ago. Today, after putting on a new fuel pump, I wanted to test it out and see if I could get my carburetor dialed in better. So I put her in the pond in my back yard, and now the starter is just spinning again, apparently not engaging on the flywheel.
The guy at the Auto electric store told me that he thought there was an issue with the fly wheel, because of the way the starter had been marked up. He showed me a round part, near the center of the starter, and pointed out that it was out of round. He suggested that something was somehow pushing the starter out of round, and that I should check my fly wheel. Well that's kind of beyond my mechanical knowledge but I can figure it out with some guidance I'm sure. I have read things that suggest the fly wheel needs to be "re-toothed" by removing it and having a machinist remove the ring around it with teeth and putting a new one on it.. But I would really like some feedback about what you guys feel the problem is. Am I on the right track? |
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lakedog55
Gold Member Joined: November-11-2010 Location: Lake Weir Fl Status: Offline Points: 835 |
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I have heard you can remove the ring and flip it over.
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Lakedog55
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78skinautique
Groupie Joined: July-03-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 71 |
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Thanks for the tip, anyone got instructions on removal?
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Gary S
Grand Poobah Joined: November-30-2006 Location: Illinois Status: Offline Points: 14096 |
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I would only go through that much work only if I could not find a new ring gear. Get it to the spot where it does not engage again pull the starter and look in at the teeth on the flywheel and see if their chewed up or missing and go from there. Engines have a habit of stopping in the same places due to the firing order and compression strokes.
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78skinautique
Groupie Joined: July-03-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 71 |
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I can't seem to get the motor to budge manually, but I have only tried by hand. Maybe I will try to advance it with some sort of leverage on the main shaft pully?? What is a good way to do that? When I try to turn the belts, nothing moves really. The belts seem to slack on one end, that's all..
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8122pbrainard
Grand Poobah Joined: September-14-2006 Location: Three Lakes Wi. Status: Offline Points: 41040 |
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You DON'T have a bad fly wheel. You have a bad ring gear!!!!! The ring gear is simply heated with a torch to expand coming off or going on!!
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JPASS
Grand Poobah Joined: June-17-2013 Location: Orlando Status: Offline Points: 2283 |
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A socket and ratchet/breaker bar on the crank pulley bolt should easily do the trick. |
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'92 Correctcraft Ski Nautique
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21132 |
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New ring gear is only $20 at any auto parts store... 157 tooth for a 6cyl mid 60's manual tranny (ford) mustang is the easiest cross reference, should be good for any marine ford Windsor.. You need a serious torch for the install, my little map gas couldn't hack it, all the YouTube guys had oxy-acetylene. Ended up baking it in the oven and it still didn't slip on nicely, but still a DIY if you're confident. Otherwise take the flywheel to a shop. Popping the old gear of was not hard at all (with the small torch). You'll need an impact gun to get the flywheel off.
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78skinautique
Groupie Joined: July-03-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 71 |
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Thanks for the info on finding one using a 6 cyl manual trans mustang! I finally got the flywheel off last night! Counted them 2 times and came up to 157 both times. But the auto stores I am calling keep telling me that their computers are calling for either a 164 tooth or 180 tooth... I will call and ask about a 157 tooth for a mustang..
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21132 |
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Don't listen to the parts store guys, the 157 is what you need- and you confirmed it! The mid 60's 6cyl mustang was what allowed them to find it in their system. Get the old one off to match up when you go pick it up to be safe, but this method worked fine for me.
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gun-driver
Grand Poobah Joined: July-18-2008 Location: Pittsburgh, Pa Status: Offline Points: 4112 |
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Skidim has them for 30 bucks
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78skinautique
Groupie Joined: July-03-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 71 |
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Yeah, but that's 3 days waiting around for a ring I can get for 10 bucks less and today, not Thursday.
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gun-driver
Grand Poobah Joined: July-18-2008 Location: Pittsburgh, Pa Status: Offline Points: 4112 |
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Well then go get it and quit wasting our time!!! |
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mark c
Gold Member Joined: May-09-2012 Location: Massachusetts Status: Offline Points: 534 |
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Heres a bunch of cross reference numbers for the 157 tooth 13.294" O.D., 12.025 I.D. ring gear.
ATP ZA-503 BIG A XG14 DORMAN 04410 NAPA 6003030 PIONEER FRG-157N SEALED POWER 416121 FORD C2OZ6384B |
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mamigacz
Groupie Joined: June-08-2014 Location: Wisconsin Status: Offline Points: 96 |
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I tryed oxy-Mapp with no success. Finally took it to a local engine builder to have the ring gear pressed on.
I'm not sure if it would save any significant money, but I was able to pound the old ring gear off (cold)in 45 degree increments with a punch. The engine builder only had to press the new gear on, and not remove the old (damaged). I also bought my 158 tooth ring gear (for a mustang) from a local parts store. |
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78skinautique
Groupie Joined: July-03-2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 71 |
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She's all back together and purring like a kitten. I bought the NAPA 6003030 and I just brought it to a local mechanic friend of mine. He knocked off the old ring and replaced it with the new one in 20 minutes and I was on my way back home to put it all back together. Thank you for your input everyone! Under 50 bucks for such a big job, can't beat that. :)
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