wringing out my boat

Havent seen much of this thread for some reason, but to answer an early question, the foam in my 83 was closed cell and while it does much better than open cell that was in my 67 it will hold a layer of water against the stringers if exposed to water. Even in a very well taken care of boat the area around the front seats, cooler, and battery box was a chance for infiltration. My 83 had low hours and showed every indication of having been very well taken care of but the wood was shot.

IMHO you could do this job with poly resin and if you take care of it it will last a good while, you can do it with vinyl resin it will last longer and be stronger, epoxy will last longer stick better than either. But for my money even if they all performed the same I would pay quite a bit more for the epoxy just because it is easier to work with. It sands nicer, no fumes to speak of, easy to mix reliably, etc. If the vinyl cost the same as the epoxy its a no brainer go epoxy.

Seperating floors and stress cracks... I wonder if some of this isnt caused by water in the foam freezing and expanding, hard to ever know for sure but it sure looks like if could cause the cracks and the floor seperation. To me even if water in the foam is kept away from the wood and the wood doesnt rot which is likely with most of the jobs I see on this site.. I don't want water in my foam and since I do pour buckets (or at least parachutes full) of water in my boat then cover it up till the next time I use it. That's why I didn't put any foam back in it, if you treat your boat better I wouldnt worry about it. Just some thoughts..

JoeinNY wrote: IMHO you could do this job with poly resin and if you take care of it it will last a good while, you can do it with vinyl resin it will last longer and be stronger, epoxy will last longer stick better than either. But for my money even if they all performed the same I would pay quite a bit more for the epoxy just because it is easier to work with. It sands nicer, no fumes to speak of, easy to mix reliably, etc. If the vinyl cost the same as the epoxy its a no brainer go epoxy.

One thing I've been gathering is that even within resin types, there are many differences. It also seems that opinions differ on which is easier to work with. The vinyl is significantly less expensive than poly. Being my first crack at this, I expect to waste some, if not a lot, so I'm going to give vinyl a shot. According to my fiberglass supplier, this blend isn't too difficult to sand either. I don't really see a significant downside to the vinyl. I'll report back on that of course once I get into it. I've been known to change my mind.

Question for you guys. Is it neccessary to grind all the way down to the hull or is it ok to leave a bit of the glass from the stringers? I was hoping to leave just a groove to help place the new stringer...

JoeinNY wrote: Seperating floors and stress cracks... I wonder if some of this isnt caused by water in the foam freezing and expanding, hard to ever know for sure but it sure looks like if could cause the cracks and the floor seperation.

Joe,
I think this is how my one secondary stringer developed a split in the fiberglass, which in turn accelerated the rot. My theory is that the foam became saturated and in time so did the wood in the stringers. The secondaries took the brunt because they were exposed in many places. The water froze and expanded cracking the glass around the stringer.

TRBenj wrote: Nope, not a problem at all- I found that leaving the bottom 1/8-1/4" of the original stringer gave me a nice way to place the new ones in the same spot.

Great news! That'll make things easier to install plus keep the dust to garage ratio down!

Here are some more pics...

This first one is evidence of rot repair by the previous owner. I guess when I asked him if he was aware of any stringer issues he probably lied. Shocking.


Old vs. new secondary. You can see very consistently where the old stringer was having the most trouble. The exposed areas are all darker and more rot infested. BTW, that old stringer weighs a ton.

critter wrote: Wow.. I wish my old stringers looked that good when I took them out.. I do not think that any my 10 pieces of stringer looked that good.

The worst of it was on the boards stacked against that secondary. The mains are in remarkably good shape. With as much trouble as I've been having finding good 2x8s in 14 ft, it's awfully tempting to leave them in.

newoldboat wrote: I'm thinking about having MONEY PIT lettered on my boat.

in fact that's what they are... but at least they are enjoyable once some of the troubles are solved...then you start again

newoldboat wrote: bought a new one with a good filter system from Home Depot So far my boat has managed to burn up a jig saw, disgraced my shop vac, and just tonight it killed my 4 1/2" grinder. Can we get a moment of silence for all the tools lost for our cause?

Joe,
You'd better start buying decent tools and not the "homeowner" quality at Home Depot - junk. Buy good tools and they will last! Milwaukee and then Porter Cable.

My Rockwell/Delta (now Porter Cable)4x24 portable belt sander's switch gave up on me Monday. It's the only problem I've had since my dad gave it to me as a birthday gift. That was when I was a freshman in high school - 43 years ago!!

gun-driver wrote: Metabo makes the best grinder on the market.

Back up your statement!

We've been running truck frame parts here at the plant for 6 years. They require secondary hand touch up grinding so I have first hand experience with 4&1/2" right angle grinders. They run almost continuosly for 16 hour days. At any given time we may have 5 grinders running at presses. We've been through all of them including Metabo's. Tried the $40 throw-aways to the $110 Milwaukee's. The service life of the Milwaukee far exceeds the "economics" of cheap grinders. The Metabo falls into the cheap catagory!!

De walt tools are the best you can buy down here..BD was good also but now its all chinese, and bosch you have to cross your fingers...My gringer is also a cheapo!! but for the use I give to it its fine,

Back from the dead. I'm resurrecting my project topic because things are finally moving forward again. I lost about 4 weeks to a pretty serious knee problem. I was able to get some of the interior skins done, but I couldn't work inside the hull for quite a while.

New secondaries are done and bedded in. I cut away quite a bit of glass to inspect the primaries and was very happy to find that they are in great shape, so my lumber troubles aren't going to be an issue. I was originally thinking about wrapping the primary stringers once more, but I'm not sure if it's worthwhile to remove all the bilge paint to do it. Either way, I'm working on the bulkhead tonight. With some luck, I'll be glassing stringers this weekend and ready for foam next week.

Kristof wrote: As you where so nice to be the first one to comment on my "little pieces of wood"-topic, I'll rekindle this topic too, bacause you got my attention on this one...

Glad to help. If you need some specific pics of anything, let me know. I've taken quite a few just so I remembered how to put things back together.

I've set aside the weekend to try and hit this project pretty hard. All the foam is in and the floor is covered in glass. I'm going to be reinforcing some of the floor areas that get the most traffic and also glassing the drivers seat base in next. I'll try to get some of my new pics up after this weekend to update my thread.

I ended up ordering a dripless seal just because I'd really like to keep this boat as dry as possible after all the work I've done (and still need to do).

If anyone is wondering about vinyl-ester, it's been pretty nice to work with so far. I don't have anything to compare it against really, but it seems fast and very consistent. The fumes aren't terrible, but I still wear a resipirator. I've been working with about 20 ounces at a time and I'll usually get 3 or 4 cups ready. Grab a 20, toss the MEK in, mix it up, glop away, grab another 20 and repeat.

Back from the dead (again). Miraculously, after reconnecting everything, the boat started right up. I'm still shocked by this. I thought for sure I would have missed some critical connection somewhere.

Carpet is going in. Hoping to get some of the seat bases installed soon. I ended up fiberglassing the driver seat base to the floor. This was one of the worst spots for rot in my boat. Shouldn't be a problem in the future.

Looking good!! Has to feel amazing to have the whole thing back together!

I've always wondered...... is it a bad thing to wrap the carpet down the side of the secondaries? Seems like it would hold water there...maybe it wouldn't cause rot, but some mildew and such?

horkn wrote: I used poly on the boat, but I have used epoxy resin on a plywood and glass fish tank. The epoxy is a lot easier to use, and not really smelly at all, unlike the poly resin. You will have it out on the water very soon now.

I sure hope so. I'm super anxious to get it on the water again.

The vinyl-ester fumes weren't too bad and even for a beginner, I found it easy to work with. I did use some pre-mixed poly based compound that the local fiberglass shop calls "gunk". It worked great for bedding, fillets and to repair my driver seat base. That stuff put out some crazy fumes.

Looking really good. What's your estimated time to complete and be on the water?