water in crankcase |
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Posted: July-26-2009 at 1:49am |
Just got the "new" engine running that came with the boat. 5 minutes or less of run time the oil is 50% water.both with garden hose and in the lake. Plumbing seems correct, engine runs fantastic. Where could the water come from? no external leaks.
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boat dr
Grand Poobah Joined: June-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4245 |
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Riser gaskets, blown head gasket...........
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Luchog
Grand Poobah Joined: April-17-2007 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 2135 |
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A bad cylinder head or intake gasket gasket.
Boat Dr, do you think a riser gasket could fill the crankcase with water? I though that would fill the cylinders only. |
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OverMyHead
Grand Poobah Joined: March-14-2008 Location: MN Status: Offline Points: 4861 |
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Here is the list I found in the forums,I feel your pain. Dave.
leo0648 The PCM manual says the most common way to get water in the oil is a cracked exhaust manifold. Lets make a list of possibilities. 1) Cracked exhaust manifold 2) Cracked exhaust riser 3) Exhaust riser gasket 4) Cracked intake manifold 5) Intake manifold gasket 6) Cracked timing chain cover 7) Timing chain cover gasket 8) Cracked head 9) Blown head gasket 10) Cracked block |
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For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats.
1987 Ski Nautique |
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OverMyHead
Grand Poobah Joined: March-14-2008 Location: MN Status: Offline Points: 4861 |
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Mine ran great also, did not leak as fast as yours. I swapped the engine out. I am still diassembling the old one to figure it out.
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For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats.
1987 Ski Nautique |
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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I'm pretty sure the even bank manifold is cracked. It drips when the engine is off. Very small amount. I don't get how exhaust cracked would do that, as stated above without getting water in the cylinders. No white smoke. I like that option, since its easiest, but I don't understand how that would work. Its a reverse rotater, so another engine is not an option for now. I think we'll pull the heads and start there. Any suggestions for testing these theories? I was thinking put water in the jacket without heads and see where the water goes. Same with the heads. We got a steal on this classic and got it titled and running (not as easy as it sounds), but we didn't plan to put a ton of cash into a block or heads.
Btw its a 79 sn. 350 omc powerplant. |
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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After removing the intake, it appears to have been cobbled together. Today it gets a new gasket and sealed properly. Hopefully this will fix it.
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Luchog
Grand Poobah Joined: April-17-2007 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 2135 |
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good luck and keep us updated!
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Not the intake gasket. Heads are now off, no obvious problems yet. Anyone have an idea of how to test the heads and the block?
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JoeinNY
Grand Poobah Joined: October-19-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5695 |
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Start with a compression test, good compression will rule out the head gaskets and the must common block cracks from freezing. It's also quick and a relatively cheap tool to buy.
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Luchog
Grand Poobah Joined: April-17-2007 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 2135 |
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You should have performed a compression test before pulling the heads.
Now, if the heads are already off you will have to send them for a hidraulic test. |
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Munday
Gold Member Joined: August-17-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 538 |
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My buddy Steve and I fought this last year.His block was cracked under the cam hard to see until all the rotating assembly was removed.Hope yours is not so terminal as his was.We had to get another block which meant new pistons,rings,bearings.
Munday |
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If the only tool you have is a hammer,everything starts to look like a nail.
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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We did compression test a few cylinders before. They looked fine. It just runs so well, I couldn't convince myself to keep testing. I have a hard time believing someone would build an engine out of a junk block, but its starting to look that way.
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TRBenj
Grand Poobah Joined: June-29-2005 Location: NWCT Status: Offline Points: 21132 |
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Did you inspect the intake manifold for cracks? From what Ive read here, the area near the thermostat housing is one of the weaker areas. |
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Luchog
Grand Poobah Joined: April-17-2007 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 2135 |
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if gaskets are ok, a crack is what you should look for.
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Well, the heads pressure tested ok. So it seems we are down to block or intake. Dad says intake looks fine, but I haven't seen it yet. I have another intake to try. We are pulling the block out for disassembly and inspection tonight. I hope to find an obvious crack. Not sure if we'll fix it, or replace it. But I hope to at least find the problem.
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Hooty222
Senior Member Joined: May-10-2009 Location: Flagstaff AZ Status: Offline Points: 141 |
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Take a look at the threaded bungs next to the rocker arms.... There was a you tube video on it... Was salt water a possibility in it's past Oh yea I am assuming a small block FORD in your boat.
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1986 Ski nautique 351
1988 Barefoot nautique 454 |
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Its an OMC chevy block. I didn't include that until about the 4th post. sorry.
I have not considered threaded bungs? Honestly I don't really know what your talking about. I'm not in front of it right now. Let me know if you find the youtube.. or if anyone has pics of that. Should have the pressure test results for the block today. |
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Luchog
Grand Poobah Joined: April-17-2007 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 2135 |
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I think he means the threads for the Cylinder head/intake bolts that might have cracked?
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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I'm hoping that would be picked up in pressure testing.
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sam57
Senior Member Joined: December-07-2007 Location: North Canton, O Status: Offline Points: 360 |
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The weak place on the Ford seem to be the heads, on the Chevrolet, the side of the block in a horizontal line.
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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Block tested ok. I guess we are going to reassemble it with another intake. Still no idea what's wrong.....
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boat dr
Grand Poobah Joined: June-27-2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4245 |
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Just for giggles, pressure test the ex. manifolds. You have done all the hard stuff......... I have a set of OMC manifolds if needed ..........
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Hooty222
Senior Member Joined: May-10-2009 Location: Flagstaff AZ Status: Offline Points: 141 |
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Since your block is Chevrolet I offer no help. But I found the link to the YOU TUBE video. Type in this: Ford 351 Windsor Small Block Engine - Water in Oil Mystery. This shows the plug failure I spoke of.
Bob |
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1986 Ski nautique 351
1988 Barefoot nautique 454 |
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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It seems to finally be fixed. The block was fine, the heads were fine. It seems it was actually fixed the first round with the re-sealing of the intake. The milkshake from there on, was actually caused by residual water. It's amazing how little of water it actually takes to cause a big mess!
Now we have no water from the fresh water pump. Thats getting fixed this week. Almost ready for a ski run.. She runs great, just warm. |
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OverMyHead
Grand Poobah Joined: March-14-2008 Location: MN Status: Offline Points: 4861 |
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Congrats
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For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats.
1987 Ski Nautique |
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Luchog
Grand Poobah Joined: April-17-2007 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 2135 |
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Well, 5 hours after my head rebuild I must call in for this thread.
Water is leaking inside of cylinder 8, I discharged all water from the exhaust manifold, took the plug out and could clearly see water dripping from above. So I guess the intake gasket did not seat properly or the head or intake are cracked. Oil pressure was fine (55psi), no loss of power, oil is creamy. I HOPE is the intake or intake gasket. |
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rookie
Groupie Joined: July-26-2009 Location: florence,ms Status: Offline Points: 74 |
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did you have the heads magnafluxed at a machine shop? also each bolt that goes into or near a water jacket area on a small block chev. should get ample sealant on the threads prior to incertion.
let me know if you are still stumped and i will ask my neighbor who owns a machine shop what he thinks? |
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do it right the first time...
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crnsuperduty
Newbie Joined: July-22-2009 Location: Kalamazoo, MI Status: Offline Points: 33 |
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This doesn't help you at all, but our is doing great!! It was the intake all along. I put a few hours on the old girl this weekend. What a joy to drive.
we never had water in a cylinder though, that doesn't sound good at all. Inside the cyl could be caused by exhaust easily. One thing to try, keep water in the block, but run it without a water source. The main problem now is once there is water in the oil its darn near impossible to get it out. We did 3 changes, it still looked like a ton of water in there. it took a complete disassemble and re-assemble to get it all out. |
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dwcar
Platinum Member Joined: February-11-2007 Location: Houston Texas Status: Offline Points: 1103 |
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Hooty222
Thanks for your post. I found water in my oil this past weekend. After some investigating, it turned out to be a toothpick size hole in one of the plugs the video speaks of. I am flushing all of the crud out now and hope to test this weekend. Hopefully nothing else was damaged. |
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83Ski
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