learning to barefoot

TRBenj wrote: My form is missing something somewhere... I might be taking baby steps as Im at least able to get my chest and chin off the water- but its still way too much of a struggle (groin). Even once my chest is up, I feel like my feet arent underneath me- like Im skiing on the inside of my feet. Ive had a taste of how easy it should be and this is not it! The rope is made from Lake Elmo's 16 strand TAC (HDPE). Its not bad, but a little stretchier than the thin BI line I have (spectra?). That BI line is always a knot fest, but I'll switch if you think its important.

Tim,
These starts are all so familiar. You're so close it's scary.

First off, you're waiting an awful long time to take your feet off the rope and planted on the water. The longer you wait, the slower your driver needs to go. You can see on every one of your starts, you start porpoising. There's only two ways to stop that....put your feet in the water or the driver needs to slow down until you put your feet in the water. You can see the common denominator here right? It's fine doing it the way that you're doing it, but the driver needs to stay sharp. With repetition, that should become easier for you.

All I keep seeing is you trying to get up with you're feet so friggin' wide yet. The reason you're having difficulty getting up is your feet (and thus legs) are so wide. When you finally do turn your toes down to get up, you're feet in reality are still angled out at roughly 30-45 degrees. That's why you feel like your skiing on your ankles...because that's exactly what you're doing!!!! Your legs and feet are so wide that you can't get your toes turned straight down. Being so wide to start only gets exaggerated as speed increases from the water pressure wanting to push your feet out even further. Get your feet closer together at the start and hold it there. Then you can easily turn your feet straight down easily. A really small detail that will make a HUGE difference that's immediately noticeable.
Remember, as soon as you get your feet planted on the water and speed starts to increase, you constantly tell yourself to touch your heels together. You'll never be able to truly do it but the idea is to over-exaggerate what you want your legs and feet to do. Your brain is still telling you that your feet and legs are fine. You need to build some muscle memory for your brain to understand.
Once your feet and legs are narrower, lock in that position and wait for speed....RELAX! I can't stress that enough. RELAX! PATIENCE. Then in one smooth, controlled motion you turn your feet straight down toward the bottom of the lake (but toes pulled up toward your knees), lift your ass in the air and push your chest into the water.

As you start to come up, you'll feel spray from your feet hitting your chin. As soon as you don't feel that spray anymore, stop raising up or you'll just keep going over backwards. Then squat down a little bit with a bend in your knees. You could probably even bring your legs together a little bit more at this time now. Then just enjoy the ride!

I tell everybody who wants to listen, you have to train your body (and your brain) to feel how hard the water is on your body. You need to FEEL the water on your feet, then your thighs, then your torso and finally your chest. As it gets harder, you'll know when you can start to make that one smooth controlled sweep of the feet, ass and chest. The boat will actually want to pull you off the water when you have speed (just like on the short line). Go too soon (like everybody does) and your feet will submarine. Unfortunately, that only comes with repetition. Trying to count for this step sucks. Different drivers, pulls and boats make the counting method unreliable. Feeling how hard the water is on your feet, legs, torso and chest make any pull from any driver behind any boat a snap. The water always feels the same at the speed you need no matter how fast or how slow you get there.

It's looking great so far. Just keep thinking to bring your feet together some more, relax and let the boat do the work.

Tim:

OK, your plane and plant are fine speed wise as long as you like it. That is more personal than anything. The gyser of water shooting up on some of your planes shows that you are good. You get a good plant, your feet are sliding on the water nice, not too much "bite" into the water, so far so good. Now, here is where the rubber meets the road:

Timing of your action and the boat's acceleration are key. The better they synch up, the easier it will be to ski. [Driver tip: once you plant, and the driver wait 1 or 2 seconds, just to give you a second to adjust and ready yourself of the acceleration. After that 1 or 2 monments, have him FIRMLY accelerate you to your top speed. 38? 40? or whatever]

In that moment or 2, after you plant, put the weight on your chest, and get your crotch off the water. Feet still sliding. This is the 3-point. I think you were "there" already in the videos.

Now, dad is going to start accelerating. You need to start bending (getting the butt up in the air) and start turning your feet down to get more bite into the water. This is a timing thing on how much bite, and how much bend relative to dad's acceleration. Andy would say "fold like lawn furniture." Willie would say "push down with your chest and chin." None of those thoughts worked well for me. I mostly stayed flat and did not progress, the speed would increase, the water got hard and could not get any bite.

So, how to get "bent?"

Don Mixon Jr. said to curl your lower back like you are "pulling out" having sex. (crude, I know). But it worked.!! As soon as I got set in my 3-point, heard the boat accelerate, I would "pull-out", push on the chest, turn the feet down, pull out, push on the chest, etc...Next thing you know I am off the water!

This is what worked for me, and maybe you too.

The point is to progress at the on-set of speed. Your butt up in the air, will cause more pull off the water. At all times when bending, keep the chin as close to the water as possible and you will not get pulled out the back, I assure you.

I don't want to minimize the importance of soem of the things the guys were saying like planting narrow, or turning the feet down. Honestly I made 10 or 20 LLBD before I ever started focusing on that stuff. At present, Andy is on me to work on those now. I think if you get too many things you are trying to do, you do none well.

As far as ropes go, your call. I just notices when you missed your start, it snapped back into the boat. A bouncy rope never helped me do anything better, that is all I know.

Feet in could mean feet in the water, not closer together. You may have easily understood that, but if he said legs instead it would be unambiguous.

Yeah Roy, a little more gas and he could generate a little lift. Then as long as he's keeping up gas gas gas.

Hollywood wrote: Lane Bowers wrote: You will only have to bring your feet in about twelve inches each before starting to feel some lift in your upper body. ^^This is what I was referring to, and I think he really should say legs, not feet, or together, not in.

Sort of semantics since the feet are attached to the legs, no? Unless he were recommending you bend at the knee (which he's not) clearly it means to bring your legs together.

Im not sure where that video of me is from the CT Mini, but I'd like to see it again. I know you said I was still too wide on the one I made, but boy, it was either narrower enough (or maybe my feet were rotated?) to feel a huge difference. I didnt have to work nearly as hard to get myself on top of the water- I just popped right up. That 12" difference may sound small but its significant. Unfortunately, its also subtle enough that uneducated drivers/observers arent much help in telling you the difference- it all looks the same to them!

So you guys only go so wide to get the planing stability. Fine, I get that, I'm over it.

Tim also said he can't get a good glide on the inside of his ankles when narrow. This isn't such a bad thing. No matter how wide you start, as you get narrow in the plant (Roy's plant not Lane's) you'll inadvertantly be putting more foot (parallelness) in the water, generating lift.

Lane Bowers wrote: You will only have to bring your feet in about twelve inches each before starting to feel some lift in your upper body.

^^This is what I was referring to, and I think he really should say legs, not feet, or together, not in.

I'm getting confused.

Feet in = toes in the water/(a good stab)/parallel ??

I don't want this to get confused with leg width.

Ha, at least the video has some redeeming qualities Steve!

Still struggling to get narrower. I thought I was going ok with that until I saw the video- Im way wider than I felt. In reading some of Lane Bower's instructions, I think Im failing to rotate my feet parallel as well. Even when Im managing to muscle my chest up off the water, I still dont feel like I have my feet underneath me. He talks about the "powerband"- Im going to try and implement some of this my next time out.

Lane Bowers wrote: ... When you feel you are able to ride at least fifteen seconds in this totally gliding position, the driver should be able to see a nice steady arch of spray off your feet. Master this stage to perfection and then you are ready for the final stage, The Power Band©. To get into the The Power Band© from this position requires a combination of rotating your feet, squeezing your legs, and pushing your butt out. First push out your butt while rotating your feet and knees inward. You will only have to bring your feet in about twelve inches each before starting to feel some lift in your upper body." "After the 5 second glide, you will now try to "follow" the acceleration of the boat by pinching your hips upward into the PowerBand position. One way to make this easier is to combine your hip motion with your foot position change. Over that same 3-4 second acceleration you need to turn your feet from the "planting" or gliding position to the parallel position. If you ever felt like you were spending too much energy to get your face off of the water, then this is where the problem is. If you ever hurt your groin trying to squeeze your legs together, then this is your solution. Notice I said nothing about bring your legs together. Your legs only need to come in from wide to shoulder width, but your feet need to turn parallel by the time your head comes off the water. The PowerBand and the foot position need to work in combination to finish during that 3-4 second acceleration. If you wait until the boat acceleration is over before you start pinching and turning your feet, then you are left to muscling the get-up stage. Driving tip: As a driver, I watch for the hips to start moving upward. If the hips are moving then I am accelerating. If the hips stop coming up, then I stop accelerating, and I even slow back down until I see the hips moving back up."

Based on my experience thus far, Im thinking I should overemphasize both bringing my legs narrower and rotating my feet parallel. Then maybe I have a chance at doing them enough.

65 'cuda wrote: On a separate topic, what is the opinion about the higher pull off the skylon, once you are up. I've skied it both way's off a wakeskate start, and think I actually prefer the lower pull off the pylon.

I like the Fly High or SFH, when I have the chance.

I know that Gizzie has used a p...y protector and she is one tough chick.

Must be crappy ski weather today. Everybody is on their computer, and not on the water!

TRBenj wrote: there are easier ways to learn and its not a building block for anything... so why bother.

Yup!

Adam,
As your feet touch the water the handle gets let out slowly so that your arms are progressively out straight as you rise up. Keeping them in will cut spray bigtime and give stability.


Steve's daughters arms are perfect.

TRBenj wrote: The 3-point is a learning tool to teach you to proper form when you plant. Its hard and unnecessary (IMHO).

Tim, if you can master it, you can use it as defensive position. It works well when you happen upon other boat wakes and your not skiing behind a BFN!

Hollywood wrote: Arms out as you stand up. If you're on your butt handle is in.

That's actually really helpful...you can probably see the progression I was talking about in each video, on my butt, arms straight, then feet under. I need to try on my butt, feet under, straighten arms and legs together.