New to me 72 Skier
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: General Correct Craft Discussion
Forum Name: General Discussion
Forum Discription: Anything Correct Craft
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=43078
Printed Date: April-26-2024 at 4:50am
Topic: New to me 72 Skier
Posted By: samudj01
Subject: New to me 72 Skier
Date Posted: July-03-2018 at 12:07am
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Everyone asked what the next boat project would be for Jesse and me and here it is... 1972 Correct Craft Skier w a 302. EDIT: ***Site was hacked and many pictures lost. I re-added the below pic. Page 4 starts pics again with some older pics as a catch-up on the process***    The Tique project was rewarding and of course will never be 100% complete but we decided to take on another project for the upcoming offseason. This one will not be done in as compressed a time frame as the Tique...so we are telling ourselves and our wives. Jesse and I took an afternoon with ReidP to take a look at some projects and we left owning this one which is very exciting. Thanks Reid! We haven't gone over it with a fine tooth comb yet so we don't know exactly what we have, but we do know that the seats pictured are not for this boat and hopefully we will find the missing fender. Also picked up a 77 Tique hull for parts and the trailer. The hull probably too far gone but we will make that decision on down the road. Hoping the 302 engine could power another boat in the future... And Joe, don't worry, we have our eye on that 1970 Gen 2 red Ski Nautique you mentioned. While we didn't fully commit the day we were there, I would put it at a very high probability that it will have a thread too  . Also, we started an instagram page @classiccorrectcrafts to show boat projects and other cool correct craft related pics. Give it a look and give us a follow. We are trying to build the follower base. Thanks. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Replies:
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: July-03-2018 at 1:13am
Square windshield skier  I'm hoping to take one over from a fellow CCFan soon myself |
Posted By: Donald80SN
Date Posted: July-03-2018 at 10:27am
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David and Jesse, Nice choice I love it. HOWEVER !!!!!!!!!!!, two guys in your condition SHOULD NOT be hanging out with Reid P. Reid is the last one on earth to visit when you have the I think I need another boat feeling. I will be in touch with both of your wives soon to set up a most needed intervention. Meanwhile, I am asking your bank suspend both of your abilities to pull out any money for anything more than beer, some food and two dollar bills for the Winston Salem Ballet. If I do not act now, Jesse's Barn will look like Reid's warehouse. I am also afraid that the friend across the lake from you with five boats is also a very bad influence. Hanging out with him might need to be taken a hard look at until you two have fully recovered. What's next skiing with no skis on your feet backwards? All I need to do is remind your bride about having to leave her car out of the garage all winter while you and Jesse play fiberglass shop. The Tique was a gateway drug, you two can't handle this alone. You need professional help !!!!!!! Just trying to help. Dr., Donald ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique SOLD Back to Cypress Gardens 2002 Sport Nautique, GT-40, FCT2, Cover Sports, Tower Bimini, Inc., Wet Sounds Audio System, Star Gazer Wake Edition S. 1968 Ski Nautique, Project. |
Posted By: Fabcon
Date Posted: July-03-2018 at 11:10am
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Very nice ------------- 1976 Ski Nautique 351 Escort 1984 Barefoot Nautique (Parting Out) |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-08-2018 at 11:58pm
Today we put the Skier in its new home for the winter. Going to start working on this one, but it will be slower than the Tique.  We started today by cleaning it out some and trying to fire it up. No clue on the condition of the engine but we hear it ran when it was put up last. Turns well with a bar. No exhaust manifolds yet bc we were just checking to see if the starter worked and whether it got spark and gas. First was spark but before we could get there we ran into another issue. The transmission seems to be stuck in gear so the starter won't turn the engine well. Trans fluid is clean looking and in the middle of the dip stick. The shifter moves the trans in to fwd, neutral and rev just fine but when we crank in any of the three positions the prop moves clockwise. Turns very free in neutral. Rebuid necessary? 71C. How to take it off since the engine mounts are built on to the trans? Prop the bell housing up with a board and remove trans?   Also, we are perplexed on our water circulation from the thermostat housing. There seems to be three hoses coming off each side which look like they would all go to exhaust manifolds. I can't find pics in my searches of this setup for 302's. Any help? The manifolds we are putting on only need one hose coming in...what do we do with the rest?   Next, while trying to fire it up, we used a handheld remote starter hooked to the solenoid. One clip on the battery post and one on the small post with the ignition wire coming from the neutral safety switch (which works). The solenoid was smoking. Any thoughts there? Has us worried a bit. It is a new style solenoid. Would love to get the motor running even for a sec before pulling it to work on the stringers. Thanks for the help and stay tuned. Hope to give some more to read over the winter. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 8:16am
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It looks like that's a Conqueror/Crusader 302 based on the picture of the thermostat housing and your hose description. TRB has one in a Skier Strictly a guess here, but if you're using the manifolds from your extra 77 302 engine, why not use the thermostat housing from that also? Or you could buy one of these. It's from Barr and just like what came on Indmar Ford engines. Just one hose to each manifold https://bpi.ebasicpower.com/shop/crusader-inboards/cooling-system/thermostat-housings/housing-thermostat-generic-raw-water-cooling-ford-302-351-4-hose" rel="nofollow - link Why don't you pull the plugs and see how the engine turns over with the starter. Maybe you have a starter issue or wiring issue. How about trying the starter from the 77 302? Or a known good one from the 78? Or testing the one that's in it now Your transmission with no shaft hooked to it and no drag of any kind on the output side is probably spinning with the engine for that reason especially if the thing has sat for years and the fluid is cold.. You could probably stop the spinning with light pressure from a 2X4 or something along those lines. No fair using body parts like hands or feet to stop it though
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Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 9:09am
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Here's a link to piles of pictures of a 72 Skier and some info to go along with the pictures Some of the info is let's say confusing and the cooling system issues may or may not have ever been figured out. He had the original manifolds with some internal issues like holes where they shouldn't be. http://www.grantmaclaren.com/72skier/" rel="nofollow - link By the way, I see a line of people getting ready to jump all over your carburetor and say it's not marine because it doesn't have J tubes. Don't blindly listen to them Get the list number from the air horn and it can be determined if it's marine. Back in 72 a marine Holley had no J tubes and it also had externally adjustable floats like yours does |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 10:16am
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There are no manifolds on either engine. We have a spare set that we will be putting on. They are black rectangular manifolds with a hose that connects the front and rear. I’ll look to see if I have a pic here. We could take the therm housing off the junk tique engine but hoping to keep that engine together too (greedy I know). We have a line on manifolds for that one too. Otherwise it is fully intact (whether it runs is another ballgame). We will try the block on the prop to see if it stops the trans. We have an extra starter or two that we can try. As for cooling, on each side, could we connect an output hose to the manifolds, and connect one hose in a U to the other outputs. Take the side outputs from 3 to 1? Any thoughts on the smoking solenoid? Pretty sure the carb is marine. Have seen many threads over the years about j tubes. The 4160 on the junk tique does have j tubes. Will check the number on this one. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: NCH20SKIER
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 10:16am
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1. Do not listen to Donald 2. How about those valve covers.... ------------- '05 206 Limited '88 BFN |
Posted By: Morfoot
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 10:26am
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+2 On what Cousin Donald said. That Reid has a way of rubbing off on you. He'd been working on me for a couple years about getting another boat and the standard answer was "I've already got one, why do I need another one? Besides I don't even live on the water." His response of course was. "Footie, ya gotta have a spare!" Then Joe and Tim start on me as well. and I caved when The Godfather put The One up for sale. Itching for another one but Heather hasn't been too keen on the idea. I'll add another one once I have a lake for a back yard. Dave and Jesse we all look forward to the progress on the new addition to the fleet. No pressure on you guys but it'd be cool to ski/drive it next Oct for the Badin Mini. Good job guys and from the looks of the size at that barn; you've got room for at least a couple more! ------------- "Morfoot; He can ski. He can wakeboard.He can cook chicken.He can create his own self-named beverage, & can also apparently fly. A man of many talents."72 Mustang "Kermit",88 SN Miss Scarlett, 99 SN "Sherman" |
Posted By: Morfoot
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 10:36am
As far as the carb goes. Get the serial #'s off it Gary has a book (maybe check the net) at the house of marine carbs by serial #'s. Kermits carb didn't have J-tubes either so I thought it wasn't a marine approved carb. Summit racing is down the street so I replaced it with one that had them. Gary checked his book and said the one on it was marine approved. Not being a carb expert by any means but I guess there was a change in the rules somewhere in the mid 70's that said marine carbs must have J-tubes installed. Joe, Tim, Pete probably know. New ones ain't cheap so I'd stick with the one ya got. ------------- "Morfoot; He can ski. He can wakeboard.He can cook chicken.He can create his own self-named beverage, & can also apparently fly. A man of many talents."72 Mustang "Kermit",88 SN Miss Scarlett, 99 SN "Sherman" |
samudj01 wrote:Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 10:46am
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Valve covers are on the list. Will prob switch with the junk tique for the time being. Carb isn’t going anywhere. Will verify it is marine of course. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 11:00am
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I figure you mean you'll try a block on the output coupling of the transmission since the shaft is disconnected Smoking solenoid is probably due to bad connections/wires or the starter is drawing lots of current, either because it's bad or the engine is too hard to turn. Installing one of the extra known good starters should tell you a lot. |
Posted By: fanofccfan
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 11:02am
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Valve covers on the list? 😳. First thing I noticed and I like em! 😉 ------------- 2004 196 LE Ski 1969 Marauder 19 1978 Ski |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 11:24am
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The cobra valve covers are available to the highest bidder. Starting bid is a new thermostat housing and a plain set of valve covers...obo. Ken. I would block the trans output or just hook the prop shaft back on and block the prop. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: Riley
Date Posted: December-09-2018 at 1:19pm
Donald, what happened to you? You should have more boats than anyone? |
Posted By: Donald80SN
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 12:04pm
Bruce, I am able to use self control in all areas expect, eating, drinking beer and running my mouth / potty mouth.  Madeleine is in Graduate School and Natalie starts college next year. I am not blaming the kids for my lack of boats, but I am waiting for them to get off the payroll. If ever. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique SOLD Back to Cypress Gardens 2002 Sport Nautique, GT-40, FCT2, Cover Sports, Tower Bimini, Inc., Wet Sounds Audio System, Star Gazer Wake Edition S. 1968 Ski Nautique, Project. |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 12:35pm
| What’s the SK#? I see a lot of details that may indicate 73 instead of 72. |
Posted By: Morfoot
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 1:38pm
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Cousin Donald...Payroll issues???? Guessing the Dancing gigs have dried up? WTH? You always tell us that you've been the main attraction since Swayze died. What gives? ------------- "Morfoot; He can ski. He can wakeboard.He can cook chicken.He can create his own self-named beverage, & can also apparently fly. A man of many talents."72 Mustang "Kermit",88 SN Miss Scarlett, 99 SN "Sherman" |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 1:42pm
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Serial number: 3402 ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: Riley
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 1:48pm
Well you better get Reid to teach you the "picking this up for someone else", harboring a fugitive" and "it won't be here long" tricks. |
Posted By: Orlando76
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 2:25pm
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FWIW my 76 had an early Escort that had a straight tube ext adjustable carb. I called the number on Holleys website and a human picked up the phone and I ran off the list number from carb and they verified it to be a 73 model marine carb. ------------- Please support The Cystic Fibrosis Foundation 1976 Ski Nautique 351 Escort 1993 Ski Nautique purple and black 351 HO PCM |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 4:10pm
The latest 72 I have written down is in the 3340’s and was built end of May ‘72... with the switchover in July you’re prpbablh right in the edge one way or the other. Lifting rings match the typical 72’s so it’s a mixed bag. No HIN on the transom I assume? |
Posted By: Donald80SN
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 4:46pm
I have been temporarily side lined because I injured my lower back by Twerking for the ladies. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique SOLD Back to Cypress Gardens 2002 Sport Nautique, GT-40, FCT2, Cover Sports, Tower Bimini, Inc., Wet Sounds Audio System, Star Gazer Wake Edition S. 1968 Ski Nautique, Project. |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 6:35pm
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Correct. No HIN on the transom. Does the throttle give any hints? Or was that pretty std in that time period? Also, would the twin airguides have been from factory? Whatever the year we are ready to get her prettied up and running. Wouldn’t mind stroking out one of these 302s but first things first. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 7:31pm
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I’ve only seen that throttle on 73’s, but without a HIN on the transom that may make it a very late ‘72. No, the airguides were added by a PO. Most, if not all skiers came without any, it’s possible that a single was offered but i suspect most were added by dealers or after the fact due to widely varying styles and mounting configuration. Only SN’s of the era got dual. Fuel gauge, hour meter and horn were all optional on the Skier, it was a bare bones model. |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: December-10-2018 at 9:40pm
I know you love your work, tough to to be side lined on the probably the biggest money making season of the year. Also want to thank you for thinking of your CCF buddies when cancelling your shows, we could of helped. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: Donald80SN
Date Posted: December-11-2018 at 10:49am
Yes, you would believe how much the lonely housewives desire to see a plump jolly fellow on the brass pole this time of a year. It is not expected, but you could setup a Go Fund Me Page to help with my acupuncture expenses and such.  I also need to re-wax a few problem areas that interfere with my thong. Unsightly rashes can occur. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique SOLD Back to Cypress Gardens 2002 Sport Nautique, GT-40, FCT2, Cover Sports, Tower Bimini, Inc., Wet Sounds Audio System, Star Gazer Wake Edition S. 1968 Ski Nautique, Project. |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-11-2018 at 11:29am
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These mental images are frightening. Back to the issues at hand...plugging up some output holes on my tstat and potential for having to rebuild a trans. Would love some thoughts on the tstat working with a single hose manifold. On the trans side I’ll follow Ken’s advice on blocking and altering other starters. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: woodyelc
Date Posted: December-11-2018 at 1:52pm
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Looks to me to be a interceptor conversion with thermo electron thermostat housing. The throttle is stock for that boat. They used the MV control on the Ski Nautique. Later on they put the MV on all the models. ------------- woodyelc |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: December-11-2018 at 1:55pm
| No it’s a conqueror crusader by thermo electron... a few of the accessories were common to the interceptor (rwp/bracket/etc) but not all. Interceptor was out of the game well before 72/73. |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: December-11-2018 at 2:55pm
| I don't know that plugging passages is a long term solution. You may be constructing flow and building internal pressure. |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-24-2018 at 1:13am
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Updates. Got some goodies from John, a fellow Ccfan in NC including commander logs and a new thermostat housing. Going to make some changes. John has some great boats, parts and an awesome shop. He is into Chris Crafts too and I can’t wait to see some of his current projects progress! We had a great day looking at treasures and talking boats. Worked on the boat this past weekend. We have spark and she fired a little with some gas down the carb. Stopped there for now as we don’t have the logs on yet and didn’t want to run. Also blocked the prop and the boat turned over well and the trans seemed fine. That said, the plates are warped or rusted. Rebuild or run to see if they go back to normal? We are thinking of rebuilding no matter to learn something. Also checked the instruments. They jump nicely on power. Hope they all work. Horn didn’t work. Traced the issue to the push button switch. Can it be rebuilt? The horn was tested and works like a champ. Next up, pull the engine and strip the boat. Hopefully this coming weekend. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: December-24-2018 at 1:48am
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Is this what your looking for? https://www.ebay.com/itm/Perko-Push-Button-Switch-Starter-Ignition-Horn-Marine-Brass-Vintage-15-Amp/273458275502?hash=item3fab6224ae:g:b50AAOSwKbpbmWlM:rk:1:pf:0" rel="nofollow - ebay link ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: December-24-2018 at 9:45am
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Did you put another starter in it or was there some other reason for the smoking solenoid issue you had earlier? Rebuild depends on how adventurous you are. It just might work fine with a little dirty neutral for a long time. If you decide to rebuild, there is a lot of info on the site and it's easier with the right tools, but you can do some improvising too. They're all listed in the Borg Warner manual Besides snap ring pliers, a pair of lock ring pliers comes in handy. Duane in Indy made all the special tools needed a few years back, with an offer to make them for people at a reasonable price Send him a PM |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: December-24-2018 at 10:02am
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Here's a link to Duane's post mentioning the tools http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=40873&title=velvet-rebuild" rel="nofollow - link |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-24-2018 at 11:19am
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Thanks for the link Gary! Exactly what we need. Used the same starter. Once the prop was blocked the engine turned over fine. Used the key this time, no smoke from the solenoid. Must have been a connection issue when we were jumping it with the remote starter trigger. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: December-26-2018 at 6:36pm
David,  The remote starter switch simply mimics the key switch feeding power to the coil on the start relay (solenoid) so the smoke is confusing. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: December-26-2018 at 8:52pm
Confusing only because who knows what a PO backyard hack has done. Possibly has used some Lucas components. If that's the case you will need to top off the smoke.  ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: KRoundy
Date Posted: December-26-2018 at 10:08pm
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------------- Previous: 1993 Electric Blue/Charcoal Ski Nautique Current: 2016 Ski Nautique 200 Open Bow |
Posted By: SNobsessed
Date Posted: December-26-2018 at 10:22pm
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That jar has to be fake. Lucas smoke is black! ------------- “Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.” Ben Franklin |
Posted By: DVskier
Date Posted: December-26-2018 at 10:27pm
| Lucas the prince of darkness! |
Posted By: Jonny Quest
Date Posted: December-27-2018 at 3:42pm
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Regarding Lucas Industries... One of my Brittish friends says: "Do you know, mate, why the Brits drink warm beer? Because Lucas makes refrigerators, too". JQ ------------- Current 2003 Ski Nautique 206 Limited Previous 2001 Ski Nautique Open Bow 1994 Ski Nautique Open Bow Aqua skiing, ergo sum |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-31-2018 at 8:24pm
Happy New Year to all. We had a good weekend with the boat...no deer though. Got it striped down, everything off except the underwater gear that will remain. Washed her and drained (cool pic of draining the water out the back). Measured it all up and ready for stringers. Before that we plan to work on some sanding and buffing to see how we can get the gel. That will determine whether this will be a coosa (most likely) or a doug fir build.   Following is what the gel looks like now. There has been some test sanding done by someone previously. We are trying to mimic this and having a tough time. See the pics below. Today we buffed with super duty and didn't come close to the results of these test spots. Then we used 1000 grit on a block and then 600. Nothing close. Any thoughts on how to get the results that are in the test spots?   Also, a quick how to on this throttle control: Best pick I have of the before:  1) unscrew the black knob (gear/neutral knob) 2) pull the lever straight off...ours was stuck on there so we used a bearing puller which worked great...we were left with this (two bolts are removed in the pic)   3) remove the snap ring on the shaft and unscrew the retainer nut (round inner disc)  4) remove bolts from previous pic and remove the outer disc  5) remove the control device from behind the fiberglass  ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: December-31-2018 at 8:32pm
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If you’re trying to restore faded color, you’ll need to be aggressive in my experience. I’d skip right to 320grit and consider going to 220grit if that’s still too slow. Teleflex control, right? |
Posted By: wiscofoot
Date Posted: February-13-2019 at 2:19pm
The 4160 on my '76 is a marine model without the J tubes. I verified this with Holley. Externally adjustable float. What are the other functional differences between marine and automotive Holley's of this era? ------------- 1976 Martinique |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: February-13-2019 at 8:08pm
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Wisco Here are a couple of questions you got asked in old posts that never got answered
So..........what's the story, is it a 302 or a 351 you have there? Here's a link with some info on throttle shaft differences between a marine and automotive Holley back then, you'll see pictures http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=35400&PN=1&title=351w-rebuild" rel="nofollow - link |
Posted By: wiscofoot
Date Posted: February-13-2019 at 9:37pm
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You’re a hawk Ken. But the advice is worth the abuse so I keep coming back here. . I played the 302 vs 351 with an old timer Air Force mechanic at work and he told me that because there are 3 sets of bolts on each timing cover that’s it’s a 302. I was confused when I found out the carburetor rating months ago wasn’t consistent with what I was seeing on other 302s both marine and auto applications. PO is a pretty savvy heavy duty diesel mechanic (obv not marine) and also told me 302. So I just took it at face value. I broke off one of the boosters fishing out a dropped wing nut In the one of the secondary barrels and have been trying to figure out my best path forward. Holly will swedge in a new one for $55 If I mail it in. I will go measure now. Can only post photos during business hours. ------------- 1976 Martinique |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: February-14-2019 at 3:47am
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The only problem is that timing covers are interchangeable between a 302 and a 351. 302--  351--  Both back to back-  ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: wiscofoot
Date Posted: February-14-2019 at 10:55am
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I meant to say valve covers. I measured the intake manifold and the mounting bolts are 9.25” center to center. ------------- 1976 Martinique |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: February-14-2019 at 11:08am
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Well so much for the old mechanic...... ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: February-14-2019 at 11:10am
So, it's a 351. Better get someone else to help other than a Air Force mechanic and a diesel mechanic. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: February-14-2019 at 11:35am
Aren't you glad I ask these silly questions? Cheapest power increase ever 49 absolutely free cubic inches PS your friends were probably thinking about a 351C or a 351M as far as number of valve cover bolts |
Posted By: wiscofoot
Date Posted: February-14-2019 at 1:41pm
Yes you are right as (almost) always. There is no replacement for displacement! I asked the gentleman today about the bad advice and he said “measure the intake bolts”...he has his moments. ------------- 1976 Martinique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: February-14-2019 at 1:45pm
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Cole, Aren't you glad you get correct advice here. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: September-12-2019 at 11:52pm
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A little update. Summer came and slowed us down (ok, boating season stopped us dead in our tracks). Was/is a good summer. And the Badin Mini is coming up. Hope we see old friends and meet new ones. So we tried all sorts of stuff to get the gel to match the test areas that were there prior to us...no luck. Tried superduty, aqua buff 1000, on and off, and then wet sanding more and more aggressive (down to 150). We could still see the difference even though we got close. We decided to gel the boat. Plan - do it ourselves. Knowledge and experience - none. Should be a learning experience. May not go well but here's to hoping. Needed to get it flipped so we could concentrate on the orange first... https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4VDtlaEgfY4" rel="nofollow - Boat Flip Time Lapse     Tough to see but there is a frame we built inside the boat so it would rest on the top of the stringers and so we could sit it on the trailer. Next was grinding out all major blemishes, filling them with vinylester resin (suggested to us over epoxy for sticking to gel coat), and sanding smooth. There were holes all the way around for an old snap cover...they gone. Still have some refilling and sanding to do.       After this step we will sand the boat to get it prepped for gel. Looking for a place with a booth and large compressor for gel. Plan is to tint gel to similar color orange and paint boot stripe. We shall see...who knows when. Stay Tuned! And come play at the Badin mini. Water was great this past weekend! ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: October-27-2019 at 12:54pm
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Putting in a little time on the skier...we have fully sanded the orange gel and are hunting down a paint booth to rent. Plan is still to shoot new gelcoat. We have done some tests and they are pretty good. Fingers crossed. We also put the engine back together. New to us Commander manifolds, therm housing and water pump. Rebuilt the carb and tested it out on the Tique. Tried to start yesterday on the stand and a few issues. Couldn't get the fuel pump to prime. We tried two pumps. Is there a secret? Running out of a 5gal gas can. If they are shot, easy rebuild? Greg suggested an inline ball primer to get it started. Also, while cranking we noticed oil leaking out of the bell housing. Strange. Thoughts on these drips? We missing plugs in these holes? Rear main seal shot? Pics below. Thanks.   ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-27-2019 at 1:37pm
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David, On the oil, was the rear main seal R&R'd? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: October-27-2019 at 2:39pm
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Not sure what r&r is. We didn’t take the bell housing off. I think this engine was running when the prior owner had it and I don’t believe the engine was opened. Parts were taken off but they were all bolt ons. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-27-2019 at 3:16pm
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In this content, R&R is "remove and refit" I wonder if the PO of the engine has the wrong rear main seal? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: October-27-2019 at 4:03pm
If you start the engine with a squirt of gas down the carburetor , it should fire and the pump will prime itself pretty easily. It may take 2 or 3 attempts for it to prime and keep pumping. Are you using clear tubing on the tank to fuel pump connection so you can see if it's sucking some gas? Or do your primer bulb suggestion to make sure the suction line is full before starting. If the pump(s) are bad, ease of rebuilding depends on what kind of pump it is and how old. An old original to the engine Carter..............pretty straightforward. A new Carter.............not so much An AC dual diaphragm pump, you can't buy a kit but Then and Now Automotive will rebuild it for you. A picture of the pumps would be good. There shouldn't be any oil slinging around the bellhousing. It can drip out the very bottom because it's not meant to be able to hold any leakage from the engine or transmission. Is it engine oil? Does the transmission have ATF in it or maybe 20W engine oil You have the rear main seal and a couple of oil gallery plugs and the big plug at the back of the camshaft that could leak engine oil. |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: October-27-2019 at 4:14pm
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All old pumps. We have quite a few. Will take pics next time. Def a few old carters. We have an in-line filter on a short fuel line and could see that gas wasn’t coming. Line is only 2 ft total. I sucked through it and got gas to the filter. Sounds like a rebuild may be necessary. The one on the boat has a glass bowl on the bottom with what seems to be a filter in it. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: November-10-2019 at 3:59pm
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While we have more I took the info I could find off of some of the pumps. Think they are all carter. One is a Carter 988. One is a Carter 6. The last just says 41414. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: November-11-2019 at 8:38pm
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And the pics: First is our thought for matching the orange of the skier. Think we got a pretty good match on a premix.  Next are pics of the pumps. Take a look and let us know thoughts on rebuilding. I have done a little searching for rebuild kits. Just not sure of their condition and or the right rebuild kit(s). Will start with one, hopefully someone knows the right kit for one of these pumps. Can the pumps be soaked in carb cleaner?         ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: November-11-2019 at 8:50pm
http://www.then-now-auto.com/" rel="nofollow - Then and Now Automotive. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 9:17am
| Check with Reid and Brad on the orange vinyl, ones been identified to match. |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 10:56am
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That color chart is for gelcoat. Want to see if we can accomplish gel before spending $ and time on the other biggies like stringers and upholstery. Hoping to order gel soon. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 11:40am
| You might be better off having a good gel guy tint some for you. The chances of finding something off the shelf that won’t be a noticeably different shade is slim to none. But if it’s cheap then there’s little harm in trying it. Gel repair is pretty easy and can always be redone if you don’t like the match... you’re only out the time and effort. |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 12:11pm
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We are shooting the whole thing so a close match is great. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 12:27pm
| Wow. How much of the old gel are you taking down to avoid having too much thickness? |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 1:29pm
 Oh my. Consider a pepper-flake of crap will clog the idle fuel orifices and require the carb to come apart and wreck your outing, I'd throw the pumps and anything that caught their cooties away. ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 3:16pm
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Looking at your fuel pump pictures, the pump in the picture with a left hand holding a rusty metal fuel line is an AC dual diaphragm pump. Then and Now can rebuild it, they won't sell the parts to do it yourself. Mille1sj had them do one recently and seems plenty happy with it. The others are Carter single diaphragm and look like oldies that can be rebuilt. Click on the link below for more info and there are some pictures of the newer Carter that maybe somebody can get apart and back together again, and also the older Carter that you can get a kit for and do yourself or have Then and Now do it for you. A few other places sell the kit for the Carter also. http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=42009&title=two-new-carter-mechanical-fuel-pump-failures-grrr" rel="nofollow - link . A good trip through a bead blaster after it's all disassembled will tell you if the Carter's are gonna survive since the kit has everything you need except the housings
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Posted By: Riley
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 5:49pm
| Why not buy a new Carter Marine or PCM? Originality? |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 7:47pm
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Leaning towards new but wanted to explore rebuild to save money, learn something and use the original part. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 7:50pm
| The new carters (which is what PCM sells at a markup) have not been great as of late. Also not rebuildable. |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: November-12-2019 at 11:11pm
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Anyone try the Airtex? Saw it in another thread. On sale now for $40 prime on amazon. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: November-13-2019 at 12:05am
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Smart money would say get a Carter from Skidim. They have a reputation to consider- if too many junk ones are coming back they will find a different supplier. Call and ask Vince if they are still problematic. They are all made overseas now that's why I rebuilt my original ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: November-13-2019 at 10:17am
It's the same construction as a new Carter |
Posted By: jarrell001
Date Posted: November-14-2019 at 12:40am
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“Wow. How much of the old gel are you taking down to avoid having too much thickness?” Good question. We sanded aggressively with 180 grit. We are going though the gel in a few places, but by no means have we sanded all of the gel off. The whole boat seams to have been sprayed fairly thin at the factory. I assume you are concerned about spider cracking? I’m listening is you have any opinions on the matter. |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: November-14-2019 at 9:27am
| No opinions other than strongly suspecting that overall thickness may lead to cracking due to the lack of strength in the gel. Some say most/all the old needs to come off? Just make sure you do your homework. |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: November-14-2019 at 10:17am
  Mine was so bad (as you can see) that I took it all the way down. Then filled the worst spots and then flooded it with a Polyester primer. Sanded again and then sprayed gel coats to proper thickness. Some have rolled the gel on. You are going to have to sand the new gel down to a smoothness that you can start buffing anyway. Horrible labor intensive job. We are applying everything backwards as the gel goes onto the mold first at the factory then the layup process begins. Good luck ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: November-14-2019 at 10:32am
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For clarity: I am by no means a gel coat expert here. Kind of a "jump in the lake and learn to swim later" type guy. Gel coat repair people earn every cent of the fee. You also need a gun with large enough nozzle to spray this stuff. Orange peel is inevitable. And don't try to thin the gel down much or it will loose its integrity. ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: November-14-2019 at 12:21pm
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Duratec hi gloss additive is your friend here, check it out. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: jarrell001
Date Posted: November-14-2019 at 12:44pm
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Duane in Indy - we have not sanded anything close to the amount you removed. I'd be curious to know what tools and what grit level you used to sand that deeply? We will be spraying with a G100 gel coat gun. I sprayed some test panels from a junk boat, and they turned out very nice. The real challenge will be even coverage and working in small batches of gel. Gary S - I've read briefly about the dura tech hi gloss additive, but have not tried it. It looks like it thins things out significantly. Our next step is to find someone who will let us use their paint booth. We may have found one in Denton, NC and may know tomorrow if it will work out. |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: November-14-2019 at 2:17pm
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Seriously reconsider using that dump gun - you guys are not spraying in a mold you are more or less painting with thicker paint. Booth is not necessary if it becomes to big a deal to find one of those temp garages/carport would work- your going to be buffing and sanding anyway ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: November-18-2019 at 11:41pm
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Grabbed the Airtex pump as it was on sale for ~$40. Will give it a shot. Put it on the engine and she fired up. Didnt get to run for long bc no water but it sounded decent for the short run on the stand. Still leaking oil out of those two back holes. Looking like we will have to get a new rear main seal...sound right? ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-15-2019 at 2:34pm
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Compression testing type of day 1-110psi 2-85 3-110 4-105 5-110 6-55 7-105 8-115 Still a runner or have to rebuild? Any troubleshooting tips to determine issue? Rings or is this just a bore and rebuild? First time down the engine path. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: December-15-2019 at 10:10pm
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Next step is to re-perform wet and see if 2 and 6 come up appreciably. The idea is to try and discern between valve sealing issues and blow by on the rings. Valve issues can be solved with a head recondition vs bottom end rebuild. |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-16-2019 at 12:55am
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Wet? In the water will make a difference. How? Or will the load make the difference. I like the potential of less rebuild. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: MrMcD
Date Posted: December-16-2019 at 3:00am
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Wet Compression test would involve adding a teaspoon of oil in the spark plug hole and doing a re test. The oil will seal up bad rings and give higher compression with a wet test. If your issue is bad valves the oil does not help and compression will remain mostly the same. An engine that has sat for long periods will have some rust on the cylinder wall and even on the valve stems. If your wet test takes your cylinder with 55 PSI and it jumps to 100 PSI you know the rings are leaking badly. I would hold off on a compression test till you run it for a while and let the rings clean up the cylinder walls and the valves pound on the seats and hopefully seat for you, sometimes the compression will jump back up if you are really lucky. As is you have two weak cylinders that need to get better or be repaired. A leak down test could help determine if the rings and valves are good. It will even show if you have an exhaust valve or intake valve issue but for now the wet test will help see what you have. Was this a good engine when it was parked? ------------- |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: December-16-2019 at 9:15am
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Since the boat's all torn apart and the engine is on a wooden storage stand or whatever, I kinda figure that if you can run it for 10 minutes or so on the stand with cooling water, that would be a good idea, then recheck the compression dry and wet to see if there were any changes. Or somebody will tell you to go high tech and do a leak down test but either will tell you what you want to know You also have that mystery oil leak under the bell housing to find so this would give you that opportunity also. And if the transmission is still hooked up you can exercise that also It's an old engine with a 2 piece rear main seal, so you're getting into the bottom end of the engine anyways if you have to replace that seal Or you could decide it's too much trouble to do all this and that a rebuild is needed but you've never seen it run yet so I'd give running it a shot
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Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: December-16-2019 at 10:43am
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Will the spoonful of oil in the spk plg hole not mess up the compression tester? Or do you put it in crank a bit to blow out the excess and then hook up the tester? Assume any oil is fine? We have 15w50 on hand I am sure. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: December-16-2019 at 9:41pm
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Whatever you have on hand will work and the oil won't mess up the compression tester. I use a little oil squirt can to get the oil into the cylinder and try to distribute it around the cylinder as much as I can. You'll find various different things written saying to use a teaspoon and others saying to use a tablespoon. I checked with Betty Crocker and 1 tablespoon is 3 teaspoons or 1/2 of an ounce of oil. There's nothing real scientific about this, you just want the oil to give a better seal on top of the rings and see how much the compression changes. The can in the picture takes 9 squirts to get a tablespoon into the cylinder and the flexible hose works pretty good to distribute the oil around. the cylinder/piston top How much you use is up to you, but I use close to a tablespoon on a low cylinder(s) like you have 
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Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: March-03-2020 at 3:22pm
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This project is all over the place. We sanded a lot more on the gel. Used DA sanders with 80grit. We still aren’t getting through this gel. The paper could suck. Making lots of dust but not getting to glass. 36 grit? Will buy 3m this time. Is there special sand paper? Are we using the wrong tool. Frustrating to say the least. On another boat (junk) we sanded through the gel with 150. This is much thicker. Any advice is welcome. In other news we got title to the trailer and are planning to have it sandblasted and painted. Will go under the tique for now. Anyone looking for an old #2 trailer? It is our tique trailer. Was wrecked and tongue modified a bit but it runs true. If any interest we can talk off line. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-03-2020 at 10:07pm
| Any engine /compression check news? |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: March-03-2020 at 11:44pm
Not for nothing but thats why I figured that gel should be restored... in cases where the gel is cracked so badly it all has to go sand paper on a da has never worked for me... belt Sanders and flap disks on grinders followed by a lot of work to get it back flat after is what I have had to do... ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: March-04-2020 at 12:18am
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This gel is not cracked. The gel is good. Just had color issues. That said I hear you on getting more aggressive. Thanks. ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: samudj01
Date Posted: March-04-2020 at 12:19am
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No compression news. Sorry to disappoint ------------- 78 Ski Tique, 72 Skier w/302's, 93 SN w/351 & 17 GS22 w/zr409 Previous - 99 Sport Nautique w/GT40 and 87 Martinique w/351 |
Posted By: KENO
Date Posted: March-04-2020 at 8:30am
Disappointed............No Mildly curious...........Yes
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Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: March-04-2020 at 11:18am
Post aggression there will likely then be the need for body filler, and primer before the reapplication of gel - then some wet sanding to flatten the gel. You could chose to paint from here - it wouldn't be gel but if the gel is in good shape and will be a good substrate a high quality self leveling paint involves a whole lot less work. - just an option ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |