$4 gas... question?
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URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=21244
Printed Date: April-29-2024 at 8:07am
Topic: $4 gas... question?
Posted By: 62 wood
Subject: $4 gas... question?
Date Posted: April-11-2011 at 7:50pm
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As gas is rapidly approaching the $4/gallon mark, I have a question...
....the last time gas was $4/gallon (2008?), from what I remember, oil was in the $140 to $150/barrel price. Today it is in the $110/barrel range.... whats up with that? ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1117&sort=&pagenum=6" rel="nofollow - 64 American Skier 62 Classic.. 73 Ski Nautique |
Replies:
Posted By: Morfoot
Date Posted: April-11-2011 at 8:08pm
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Steve, It's funny you should mention this as it seemed to be the topic of discussion today around the shop. I'd bet my last gallon of gas that the oil companies will post RECORD Breaking Profits AGAIN!
On a positive note for the day Oil was down $3 a barrel which I'm sure we will all see an immediate decrease in the price of gas. It goes up $.15 in an 8 hour period when the price is up. I'm sure the opposite is true right?  ------------- "Morfoot; He can ski. He can wakeboard.He can cook chicken.He can create his own self-named beverage, & can also apparently fly. A man of many talents."72 Mustang "Kermit",88 SN Miss Scarlett, 99 SN "Sherman" |
Posted By: 62 wood
Date Posted: April-11-2011 at 8:17pm
You got that right Tim! I dont seem to hear people screaming as loudly this time? Are we just getting used to it? ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1117&sort=&pagenum=6" rel="nofollow - 64 American Skier 62 Classic.. 73 Ski Nautique |
Morfoot wrote:Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: April-11-2011 at 9:20pm
You know the answer to that Steve.The ones who bring it up are keeping quite because they are the ones in favor of the current management. On a completly different subject,I'm thinking of putting a 4 or a 6 in my boat ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: SNobsessed
Date Posted: April-11-2011 at 9:43pm
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They got the gas & we want to burn it. I'd say they got us over a $110 barrel.
I'd ride a bike, in the rain, for a month, just to save enough gas money to go skiing for an hour - it's that much fun to me. ------------- “Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.” Ben Franklin |
Posted By: 62 wood
Date Posted: April-11-2011 at 9:59pm
I was wondering how the big "D" and"R" battle enters in.. ......must make a difference on who's in "charge"? and I do like my 6 banger in times like this! I'm like Chris, might not be able to get out as often, but will still get out!  ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1117&sort=&pagenum=6" rel="nofollow - 64 American Skier 62 Classic.. 73 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: sethro
Date Posted: April-11-2011 at 11:05pm
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The most painful part to me is realizing that the last 10 miles I just drove in my truck cost me $4.00 or $3.75 or whatever the price per gallon might be...in gas alone.
As to your orignial question...I've decided it's something I will never fully understand. 
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Posted By: gun-driver
Date Posted: April-11-2011 at 11:22pm
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This is why my wife and I both drive diesels and I make my own Bio-diesel. It costs me a little less than a buck a gallon to make and the money we save goes in the boats.
If I lived in the south I would do the veggie conversion, thats even cheaper than making the bio. |
Posted By: boat dr
Date Posted: April-11-2011 at 11:34pm
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I guess I am too die hard to give it much thought. I will put hours on my boats, period. At 4 bucks a gallon not as many tankfuls, just longer slower cruises. Boat dr ------------- boat dr /diaries/details.asp?ID=4631 - 1949 Dart /diaries/details.asp?ID=1533 - 1964 American Skier |
Posted By: hasbeenskier
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 12:16am
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Try running a fleet of HD2500 service trucks avg. 150. milea a day.
bj ------------- hasbeenskier |
Posted By: gun-driver
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 12:54am
If your fuel is taxed like it is in Pa all I can say is OUCH!!! $4.25+ in Pa mostly road tax. |
Posted By: horkn
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 1:25am
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Since my boat runs great now, and I have a great job, I will burn gas in the boat even at 5 dollars a gallon. As it sounds, the $5 mark will be in full effect by the heat of boating season. My weekends and time off are worth far more than anything else. I have noticed that taking slow cruises will really extend a tank of gas.
And yes, record profits for big oil are here already. Why at 110 a barrel are they at around 4 dollars a gallon when the last time gas prices were this high a barrel was a good 30-40 dollars higher? That's a great question. Big oil knows why, and it should not have anything to do with the dems in power as they are opposed to big oil getting richer. I'm taking the bike tomorrow and Thursday to work. At the current rate of gas prices I save like 7 bucks a day by riding the motorcycle than taking my car. ------------- 78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/horkn/fish/nautique.jpg |
Posted By: sweet77
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 1:29am
$104.00 in my 3500 Chevrolet service truck today im getting 11.4 miles to the gallon. I drive roughly 125 mi a day yeah it sucks. ive just decided i took up the wrong business. Should have just been born rich  ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5528&sort=&pagenum=1" rel="nofollow - 76 Nautique "If you do what you always did,You'll get what you always got!" "An empty wagon makes t |
Posted By: davidg
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 1:45am
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Drill Baby....Drill!!!!
We need to use our own resources instead of relying on OPEC! I remember in '08 gas in downtown Chicago was $4.60/gal. Here in the suburbs, it was ~$1.00/gal less. Now, most stations around here are at $4.09 even in the milktoast burbs. But, whats the alternative? A Chevy Volt?? 
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Posted By: MartyMabe
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 1:54am
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GaryS-- I've got another Buick V-6 hanging on the Engine Stand right now! You want to build it up nice? As for the driving the Company truck--The 99 Toyota Tacoma gets 22 mpg ,in the city- I get 330 miles a tankful, and I drive no less than 200 miles a day!! Fill up every other day!
And the guy next door at Sunshine Racing- he has his VW Jetta set up for Veggie Oil. In the mornings, when we have the doors open, you can smell him pulling in. We might smell Hush Puppies one day and Fish the next! ------------- 66 Skylark http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5041" rel="nofollow - 93 SN If you're not living in NC, you're just camping out! |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 3:32am
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In 1976 gas cost .60 per gallon today it is about $4.00 an increase of 666%. In 1976 bread cost .30, today average is 2.28, an increase of 933% yet I never hear complaints about big bread profits. I have heard oil company profits have been remakably consisten at a return of 7% on the dollar invested for years. That is a return of 1.07 for every dollar spent. In 2008 when then candidate hillory clinton was complaining about record profits for oil companys racking in that big 7 cents on the dollar, verison wireless made 100% profit, 2 dollars returned for every one spent, but the media and politicians make the oil companies out as the greedy bad guys, and our ignorant electorate buys the whole scam. Demand for gas rises nearly every year, giving oil companys record sales nearly every year. Taking the same 7 cents on the dollar for each gallon of gas gives them record profits nearly every year. It is all about volume. At 4$ per gallon oil companys make about a 28 cent per gallon profit, meanwhile in Minnesota gas taxes are 45.6 cents per gallon. The oil companies buy or drill for the oil, transport it or build pipe lines, refine it, store it, transport it to the gas stations and sell it for .28 cents per gallon profit. What is the government doing for its 45.6 cent share? Building light rail? Have you ever tried to hook up your correct craft to a light rail train? As far as the differnce between 2008 and now, oil is sold in us dollars and that has not changed (yet),but it is not just the purchase of raw crude, everything the oil company has to do (listed above) has to be paid in US dollars. With our country monitising its debt, our currencies value is dropping on the world market, and we are seeing real inflation in transportation cost here in the U.S.. also in Minnesota gas taxes have gone up 5.1 cents per gallon since 2008. It all adds up, and goes way beyond oil company profits. ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: Kristof
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 8:26am
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Current fuel prices in Belgium...
Diesel: 1,463 euro/liter equals 8,039 $/gal Gas: 1,679 euro/liter equals 9,226 $/gal LPG: 0,692 euro/liter equals 3,803 $/gal And they're gonna keep going up in the following weeks... 
Just to put things back into perspective for you guys... ------------- - Gun control means: using BOTH hands! - Money doesn't make one happy, but when it rains cats and dogs, it's still better to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle... |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 9:49am
Is your diesel the low sulphur kind because youres is considerably less than gas and ours is the opposite? What can you expect, they have us paying a buck for a pint of water. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 9:52am
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are we surprised? ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 10:21am
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here is my logic, because i drive a diesel, people alawys question me why i drive a diesel, and i will from here on out, they always say diesel is more expensive than gas so why would i want one. here is my reply, you are roughly getting 20 mpg on gas, i get on average 45 mpg, so to go 45 miles it costs me 4.00 bucks for you to go 45 miles it costs you about 8.50....is this very hard to understand?....now if your getting 12 mpg, figure that out lol
the only way i ever get a raise is to cut down on costs, so driving the diesel was my raise for the year ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 10:23am
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needless to say, that wasnt a bad raise ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: gun-driver
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 11:20am
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When I got sent on my little vacation by Uncle Sam overseas in '04 diesel was cheaper than gas. I sold my F150 before I left, before I returned I ordered a new '06 diesel to be waiting my return. Diesel was now more than gas.
Ultra-low process had some to do with it but it's also the road tax we're paying, I get to pay the same road tax as a semi truck. The upside is the mileage increase like Eric stated. With my 150 pulling my trailer I got 8mpg with my diesel pulling the same trailer on the same trip I get 16mpg. |
Posted By: emccallum
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 12:10pm
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I have a few friends with newer diesel pick-ups and they dont get double the mpg that I get in my F150. Granted, they can tow a house, and have a heavier truck. It seems the diesel motor is about 10K more than the gas version. If diesel is .30 more than gas that means you have to use over 33,000 gallons of diesel to pay the extra cost of the motor. Bottom line, if you need a diesel, buy one. But, the gvt has the game rigged to make you pay about the same cost per mile as the gas. No free lunch with the diesel.
Isnt it funny how diesel prices changed about the same time the more efficient diesels started hitting the market? |
Posted By: PAPA
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 1:00pm
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Posted By: PAPA
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 1:07pm
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Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 2:17pm
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Chalk that up to government regulation.there is a anti gas war law that sets the bottom price for gas (a certain margin above cost. This is designed to protect the little guy from a prolonged price war from a big player, but also eliminates fire sales on gas. ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: skicat2001
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 5:20pm
We got to pay for Obama fancy trips... 
What gas price range up there in the north and east??? Average down here is 3.59 and 3.79 depending where you go?? I hate Shell gas... Seem to be always higher than others  This off course is 87 octance prices... ------------- 1985 CC 2001-SOLD Lee Michael Johnson |
Posted By: skicat2001
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 5:21pm
10 4 David  ------------- 1985 CC 2001-SOLD Lee Michael Johnson |
Posted By: skicat2001
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 5:28pm
10 4 david
What are the prices up north and east??? Down here in tx ranges from 3.59 and 3.79.. Depending where you go?? Shell try to stick to peps down here. They always higher than evryone else. Those prices off course was regular octane ------------- 1985 CC 2001-SOLD Lee Michael Johnson |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 5:35pm
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On my way to the Hurricane flipping, I paid $4.04 the other day. I need to fuel up tomorrow and I'll see what it's gone up to. Damn, with the card $$$ limits at the pay at the pump, now it will defiantly be a two credit card fill up! ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: ky82sn
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 6:11pm
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The reason gas is going to continue to go way up in price is because our current leadership in DC has placed a moratorium on drilling in the Gulf.
This started at the beginning of the BP Oil Spill. No one can drill in the Gulf until this is lifted. I don't think they will lift the ban until we elect folks who are pro USA and elect people who have the citizens of the US and not other countries and religions in mind. We have a Congressmen in KY, Steve Guthrie who is running his campaign based on Energy and the US being completely dependent on our own Energy Resources. I think he truly understands what the cause of this current recession is and unless we all get our heads out of the sand and vote for folks like him you may be talking about $10. per gallon gas and you may be thinking about selling your CC boats. I hope it doesn't get to that. ------------- 1982 ski nautique 1966 Al Tyll Skier |
Posted By: emccallum
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 6:19pm
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The US is supporting offshore drilling!!
From WSJ article: "Obama Underwrites Offshore Drilling Too bad it's not in U.S. waters. You read that headline correctly. Unfortunately, the Obama Administration is financing oil exploration off Brazil. The U.S. is going to lend billions of dollars to Brazil's state-owned oil company, Petrobras, to finance exploration of the huge offshore discovery in Brazil's Tupi oil field in the Santos Basin near Rio de Janeiro. Brazil's planning minister confirmed that White House National Security Adviser James Jones met this month with Brazilian officials to talk about the loan. " Goto WSJ online for the whole article....if you can stomache it! We are sooo *************** stupid in this country. Put people to work, drill our own and be done. |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 9:49pm
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Luck you Eric. My little diesel (F250) gets 11-12 @>$4.00 per gal.
My new campaign is $100. I hand the attendent $100 and get as much as I can. I plan it wil be the same with the boat cause by summer it'll be $5 a gal and the tank is 32gal They'll see a hundred but will never see full. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: Keuka
Date Posted: April-12-2011 at 11:00pm
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Last summer I would pull up to the pump, pump gas into the suburban till it shut off at $75.00, then pull ahead and do the same in the Martinique. I have found that if you hit the "pay inside credit" button on the pump it doesn't shut off at $75 at my local station. Last fill up in the 'burb was $106.
David ------------- 86 Martinique |
Posted By: gun-driver
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 12:21am
The diesel is a $6,000 upgrade but along with the better towing and fuel economy you get a better resale value. I went to Kelly Blue Book and ran my truck with the diesel and then with the 5.4 Triton V8. The 5.4 was listed at 24,000 the diesel at 31,000. |
Posted By: horkn
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 2:31am
Drilling won't cut what the world will use by the time those drills produce anything. We do need to use our own resources, and it will probably come from the US armed forces developing biofuel as a viable alternative to unsafe shale gas production and other less viable and or responsible methods. As an odd bit of fate, the same day that "deepwater horizon" killed all those workers and sunk, the US navy flew their first biofuel powered fighter jet. Forcing the burdon of developing biofuel and alternative fuel on the US automakers is not the quick solution. The military getting the infrastructure to do biofuels will allow us to get a huge jump start on the real fix. ------------- 78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/horkn/fish/nautique.jpg |
Posted By: horkn
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 2:33am
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The US buys oil from 2 democratic countries...
Brazil and Canada. Nothing wrong with that. Relying on oil from countries that can't stop their own infighting ( middle east) is not a wise thing to do. ------------- 78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/horkn/fish/nautique.jpg |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 10:21am
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I love the guys at the pump who, when done turn it off and wiggle the hose thinking their getting the gas left in the hose.
Brazil, uses sugar cane based ethanol???? moreso than crude... anyone notice food prices skyrocketing? Im with Trump on this one, protection will cost you. ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: Waterdog
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 10:43am
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Gun driver,
Tell us more about making your own bio diesel. How much fuel can you make a week ? Did you build the distiller or buy a pre made one ? The cost of the distiller ? How much room do you need in the garage for the distiller ? Ect... ------------- - waterdog - http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=3896&sort=&pagenum=2&yrstart=1978&yrend=1978" rel="nofollow - 78 Ski Tique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 1:11pm
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you guys would never believe what i passed this morning, the gas station hah
dog, i think you are thinking of cornmash whiskey, next thing will be a grow room ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: Morfoot
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 2:10pm
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I see the only problem with biofuel for Joe Q consumer is that fights will surely happen over who gets Mickey D's french fry oil when they are done with it.
We have a couple of guys here at work that run their trucks on bio-fuel and one even has a huge plastic tank in the back of his for collecting used oil. ------------- "Morfoot; He can ski. He can wakeboard.He can cook chicken.He can create his own self-named beverage, & can also apparently fly. A man of many talents."72 Mustang "Kermit",88 SN Miss Scarlett, 99 SN "Sherman" |
Posted By: Waterdog
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 2:11pm
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Eric,
My Cummin's gets 26 mpg, 75 mph @ 2000 rpm. Last trip to Mi we went from Cleveland to Raliegh NC on 1 tank. If I push it 740 mi on a tank of fuel. ------------- - waterdog - http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=3896&sort=&pagenum=2&yrstart=1978&yrend=1978" rel="nofollow - 78 Ski Tique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 4:29pm
I just fueled up - $4.16 a gal. for diesel!  ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 5:47pm
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and you just posted one of those reversable numbera 14141
MA today $4.09 to $4.13 Ten minute drive into CT $4.22 & $4.31 ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: Behl
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 9:05pm
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Pilot here in Indy today is 4.05. Our coach gets just over 4 mph. Hard to keep passing cost on, for people are starting to not want to travel even at a group rate. ------------- Steve in Indy http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1702&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1976&yrend=1980" rel="nofollow - Redone 1977 Ski Tique |
Posted By: malcolm2
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 10:01pm
| Obama wants our fuel prices to be like they are in Europe...He said that before people voted for him. Just proves no one listens. I hate to wish my life away, but he has got to go. Problem is the next guy won't take us back to $1.75 gas either. DRILL, DRILL, DRILL! |
Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 11:31pm
I had a tremendus tail wind coming home from SJRR. Pulling my boat at 70mph I got 25 mpg with my Jeep AND it starts in the winter ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: horkn
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 11:33pm
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malcom, drilling here is not the real answer. Not at the rate China is consuming oil. Remember, we owe China a TON of money. More future in oil belongs to biogas and other non traditional fuels.
I took my motorcycle today and yesterday to work. I saved about 16 dollars on gas versus my car for the 2 days even though I had to endure 2 morning 40 minute commutes at 37 degrees. Back to the near 20mpg car again for thursday and Friday due to rain. ------------- 78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/horkn/fish/nautique.jpg |
Posted By: gun-driver
Date Posted: April-13-2011 at 11:48pm
Made my own processor. I make around 40-120 gallons a week.(40 gallons per batch)How much I make depends on our demand and how much time I have. Right now I have a little better than 240 gallons in stock so I make a little here a little there to keep the inventory up. Here's a couple of places to start reading. These guys are the CCF of Bio. http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum168/ - http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum168/ Some good info on these forums http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/cfrm/f/498605551 - http://biodiesel.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/cfrm/f/498605551 This is a good place to get an idea of what it takes to make Bio http://www.journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_mike.html#filter - http://www.journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_mike.html#filter |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-14-2011 at 9:44am
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put yourself in a position of profits, lets say your the drug dealer down on the corner and no metter what you do, you have a steady stream of customers, they need that drug regardless, their addicted and you feed off of this, you know if you jack the price up that day they will beg borrow or steal to pay that. on the other side of the coin these addicts are going to re-hab not needing that drug as much so your stream of customers diminishes, your not so dependent on that dealer anymore, he needs to set up shop in a different neighborhood to keep up his habit, you need less and less of that drug..its a simple choice just like Horkn riding his motorcycle back and forth,
we mandated i believe the mpg ratings from 24 mpgs to 32mpg's starting in 2013, its not the government which they have no control of oil prices, they are in control of keeping it lower by defending the countries that do produce oil, Really are gas is cheap compared to the rest of the world, but, if you can see the Europeons are not driving around in big Escalades, dodge hemi's, they have acclimated to the high oil prices they pay....so does the problem start with the government? probably not ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-14-2011 at 9:47am
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fck, kristoff pulls his boat with a car, and his boat runs on propane,.... acclimation ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-14-2011 at 9:48am
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Gunny's doing the same damn thing, not relying ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: malcolm2
Date Posted: April-14-2011 at 1:49pm
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We don't need to drill to flood the market with additional supply, we need to drill to become self sufficient. We do not need to keep oil as a world commodity. Drill, refine, and consume our own oil. Wind, Solar, Electric and Hydrogen are never going to over take oil, not in my kid's lifetime. You know it won't be long before the Gov gets into all your homemade biofuel business. You don't pay taxes, but you drive on the road. They will tax ME more when I register the vehicle to pay for your non taxed bio-fuel.
Why do I hate the Gov. so much? Clark |
Posted By: malcolm2
Date Posted: April-14-2011 at 1:53pm
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I love this website. http://www.twincitiesgasprices.com/retail_price_chart.aspx
It doesn't answer your question, but it does show the issue graphically. You can pick the cities, add the crude line, change the time graphed. It is great. Clark |
Posted By: malcolm2
Date Posted: April-14-2011 at 1:57pm
| It certainly did start with the free market, then the gov. got involved and now the free market has very little to do with the price of gas. |
Posted By: gun-driver
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 12:28am
Sorry about that...NOT!!! You have the same choice as me, either pay out your nose at the pump or take things into your own hands and do something about. I chose to do something instead of crying about high prices. |
Posted By: Nautique Fan
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 2:29am
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We took on fuel in Midway, Chicago. At 7.04/gal for Jet A I'm glad I'm not paying for the fuel. Too bad we burn about 450 gal/hr. Makes the 25 gal I burn in a weekend in the NSS seem like nothing. ------------- 1997 Nautique Super Sport 1989 Ski Nautique 2001 (Sold) |
Posted By: malcolm2
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 10:50am
| I am not crying about high prices, I am BITCHING about the unintended consequences of government meddling. and I wish I had a diesel. |
Posted By: gun-driver
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 11:22am
I agree with ya about the government. Did anyone notice the cost of most food products increased when they mandated the 10% ethanol and now they're pushing for 15%. Take a look at the ingredients, in most food products "CORN" in some form is one of the main ingredients. Let alone the ethanol is #$@king up all our motors other than the car we drive daily. |
Posted By: Morfoot
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 11:30am
Well, seeing as how my Dad and Mom still have farms in Iowa and Illinois the price of corn has gone up so at least the hard working farmer has a little better life $$ wise. Just wish my Uncle and Grandfather were still around to see it ( well somewhat). Both were in their late 70's and still farming when they died. ------------- "Morfoot; He can ski. He can wakeboard.He can cook chicken.He can create his own self-named beverage, & can also apparently fly. A man of many talents."72 Mustang "Kermit",88 SN Miss Scarlett, 99 SN "Sherman" |
Posted By: malcolm2
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 12:11pm
And that is why food prices are going up. Farmers are growing CORN, 'cause they get paid more....So other food prices go up, 'cause the supply has dropped. Government Meddling AGAIN. |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 1:34pm
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we are not under a dictatorship and last time i checked we were all able to freely make our own choices, maybe its time to start making wiser choices....not living like free spirited hippies in a free society, i really think it all boils down to the choice we make can controls the governments outcome...really im thinking today already what i will be doing tommorow, getting in the car and mapping out the best route and not going out 3 times for the things i need....simple things like that. oh, and not buying any Chinese sht lol ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 3:09pm
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Eric, when your government is under the control of a bunch of tree hugging liberals, and denighing its citizens the contries own resources, you are very close to a dictatorship. They are forcing you to make the decisions they want you to make. You can follow like a sheep and do as you are doing which is exactly what they want, this will kill your business at the same time, or you can speak up. Vote in peoplr who will let us use our resources as we see fit, not them.
------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: BuffaloBFN
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 3:26pm
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Plan ahead, buy a smarter car...sounds good right? Well they're already considering a milage tax to make up for gas tax revenue lost to all electric cars. We all know you can't sue city hall, but it's even tougher to 'out-shaft' em! ------------- http://correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2331&sort=&pagenum=12&yrstart=1986&yrend=1990" rel="nofollow - 1988 BFN-sold "It's a Livin' Thing...What a Terrible Thing to Lose" ELO |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 4:00pm
+1 Reduce demand where applicable. It's too bad that we have a 1950's car-based transportation infrastructure (and mindset for most people), but we can still try to do our part to reduce gas use as much as possible. I have a separate car just for commuting which gets better MPG than my truck. I'm also getting a motorcycle license/classification this summer. On the positive side, high gas prices might open some eyes and minds out there. Make them think twice about their driving habits and lifestyles. Reduce pollution. Encourage community development based around walking, biking, and public transportation. Efficient land use and urban planning. That said, gas prices won't stop me from towing my ridiculously thirsty V8 ski boat with my V8 SUV at least 2K miles this summer  ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: 62 wood
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 4:41pm
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I'm kinda with you Joel, I am not going to let gas prices stop me from one of the few enjoyments in life.... slow down a bit, maybe, but not stop.
I havent had a bike for over 20 years... keep "threatening" my wife that I am going to get one because of gas prices. Actually its just the excuse to get another. In reality, the numbers dont work out.By the time you buy the bike, add insurance and plates, and factor in the fact we can only use it 1/3 of the total year(if your lucky), the savings are not there. Plus, with our business, I haul something almost daily. (BTW, Dont let my wife see this part) ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1117&sort=&pagenum=6" rel="nofollow - 64 American Skier 62 Classic.. 73 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 6:05pm
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actually our gov has been doing a petty good job at keeping fuel prices low, it would be GD easy to throw a 2.00 tax on it and pull us out of the deficit, obviously it would throw the country on its knees....but i have to hand it to them for the price we do pay at the pump. oil companies are part of the private sector and basically can do whatever they want. ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: watrski
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 6:33pm
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I don't care about high fuel prices.
Less tubers. Less jetskis. |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 9:16pm
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[QUOTE=eric lavine] actually our gov has been doing a petty good job at keeping fuel prices low i have to hand it to them for the price we do pay at the pump. oil companies are part of the private sector and basically can do whatever they want.[/QUOTE
What? WHAT? That is like a women who got raped saying "I have to say that rapist was pretty nice, I could have been gang raped". The private sector can not stay in business charging "Whatever they want", supply and demand along with competiuton regulate the price. The government however has no competion and does charge whatever we will accept. ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: horkn
Date Posted: April-15-2011 at 10:38pm
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Yes, the government actually has been good at keeping the prices as low as possible.
Anyone disagreeing with that should go live somewhere that fuel is very expensive and still makes our current high prices seem laughable. That would be most of the democratic countries int he world by the way. Dave, your analogy is a bit drastic to say the least. I'll say it again, because unfortunately it's been falling on deaf or closed ears, but corn is a horrible source of food for anything. It makes better fuel than food. If anyone wants to argue that point with me, go eat a couple cobs of corn and when you take a #2, you'll see why. It's largely indigestible. Pigs, chickens, cows, fish, they feed it to all those "farm" stock and they become fat and out of shape. Make it into corn syrup, and while it does sweeten stuff up, it's known to very bad for you. It's probably the biggest reason for the increased rates of diabetes in America. Also, ethanol is not as bad as many people think it is for engines. Internet hype will easy make anything seem like it is the best or worst thing ever. Anyone bitching about gas should probably buy a more efficient vehicle. I'm shocked that some folks still use H2 hummers for daily drivers. I'm not happy about gas prices being as they are now, but I won't rant about it. I drive 70 miles a day, and I don't do much more than a little complaint once in a while. Then again, my old SUV got about 3-4 mpg less than my not so fuel efficient v8 car does. Big oil has been relying on the repugnicans for convenient tax breaks and the means to post huge profits even despite lean economic times. Ever wonder why Shrub flew his Middle eastern cronies out of the US after all the planes were grounded in 2001? If protocol had been carried out, that plane would have landed in about a million pieces after being blown up by a couple of US fighter jets. In any case, biofuel from will be taking the place of ethanol in the near future. %20 - http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=biofuel-from-bacteria ------------- 78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/horkn/fish/nautique.jpg |
Posted By: M3Fan
Date Posted: April-16-2011 at 12:49am
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Nice to see some remotely progressive views here on occasion. ------------- 2000 SN GT40 w/99 Graphics/Gel 2016 SN 200 OB 5.3L DI https://forum.fifteenoff.com |
Posted By: OverMyHead
Date Posted: April-16-2011 at 1:05am
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Sorry Tom, But I am not going to thank the government for bumping up the price of my fuel by 50 cents a gallon. At least not until they start spending the money more prudently. Your logic escapes me, if I complain about the cost of fuel for my truck or boat, what makes you think I am funded to spend thirty grand on a prius that can't pull my boat or haul my tools. Now I need two insure and maintain two vehicles. I am complaining because our government is giving money to Brazil to develop thier oil industry and promising to be their best customer while banning our own oil companies from drilling here when our unemployment is at 9%. Our fuel may be cheap compared to other some countries but it could be much cheaper. Oil is the lubricant of our economy. Restricting it slows the economy. Severely restricting it grinds the economy to a halt. In a free country I see the governments role as providing thing that individuals and private companies cannot provide for themselves, not dictate what will be provided as a matter of social policy. Gas taxes are to pay for transportation, and it is clear americans like to drive their own cars, few choose public transportation unless they are forced into using it, so those that think they know what is best for us divert money from roads to build light rail and fund bus sytems that can never support themselves finacialy and than try to increase the cost of fuel to get us to use their idea of transportation.
Your are correct that corn is not the best utilized food by our bodies, but it is an even worse fuel. If we converted every inch of farm land in the us to growing corn forfuel, there is no way we can ever grow enough to replace oil, not even close. Currently ethanol is subsidised to come close to competeing, between the state and federal funding ethanol recieves $1 per gallon subsidy. that means I not only pay for my gas but my tax dollars pay for someone else to use an inferior fuel. It also reguires duplicative systems for transport and refining reducing efficiency, since it delivers less energy per gallon we end up using up more storage and transport capacity per unit of energy. Despite it being advertised as clean burning it puts out more particulate pollution and is worse for asthmatics. Corn production uses horrific amounts of water resources. The worst part is using food for fuel by the law of supply and demand increases the cost of food. The government magically keeps food and fuel out of inflation figure, if included we would be seeing significant inflation right now. I believe biofuels will be part of our future, but we need to use waste bio sources, not food. Re-purposing used fryer oil is brilliant. if we can make it out of fallen leaves and grass clippings great. If we can filter the algea out of the lakes that comes from farmers fertalising their corn crops even better. But we have to get the technology to the point where an alternative can match or beat the price of curently used fuels, and not by artificially inflating the price of oil. We have 100 years of oil right here in the US. By the time we use it up we will have alternatives. no nead to deprive ourselves now. When the time is right and it is profitable people will line up to produce alternatives. ------------- For thousands of years men have felt the irresistible urge to go to sea, and many of them died. Things got better after they invented boats. 1987 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-16-2011 at 11:27am
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natural gas is very viable at .60 cents a gallon and fleets are converting....some seem as if they want the best of both worlds but dont wanna pay the piper. i dont know the exact figure of how many barrels the US uses a day but its staggering...as soon as they came out with oil burners i went from paying to take my oil away to getting paid for my oil...many lives were sacrificed for the 4 bucks we pay at the pump ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: horkn
Date Posted: April-16-2011 at 12:15pm
Thanks, Just because we like our big V8 ski boats doesn't mean we need to lean to the right all the time.
At some point in the near future, as long as I stay at the company which I work for, I'll be looking at bare minimum getting a much more efficient car. That mean hybrid, maybe a tdi Vdub like Eric, or even a all electric vehicle. Ford's all electric focus will be coming out soon and will have a 100 mile range at least. Having nearly been rear ended yesterday (driving the audi) on my way home has me rethinking taking the bike all the time it's not raining. Had I not been watching everything, the jeep patriot directly behind me that was rear ended by a wrangler would have hit me had I not stepped on the gas and got very close to the car ahead of me. The patriot driver must have let off the brakes and moved forward after getting rear ended. That's the second time since August that I avoided being rear ended in the Marquette interchange area of MKE since I started my new job in August. If we wouldn't be planning our wedding this summer, I'd probably be get a more efficient car this summer already. ------------- 78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/horkn/fish/nautique.jpg |
Posted By: malcolm2
Date Posted: April-16-2011 at 3:45pm
AMEN BROTHER! |
Posted By: horkn
Date Posted: April-16-2011 at 4:10pm
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I think once the richest people get taxed accordingly, that all the complaining and bickering over these little issues will die out. Once the middle class don't have to pay the majority of taxes it will free up a lot more usable income.
Yes, it does all go back to that. ------------- 78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/horkn/fish/nautique.jpg |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: April-17-2011 at 12:00am
Has Holger Beckmann been informed? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: emccallum
Date Posted: April-17-2011 at 1:12am
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Horkin (and other libtards),
From the IRS data: "The top-earning 5 percent of taxpayers (AGI over $159,619), however, still paid far more than the bottom 95 percent. The top 5 percent earned 34.7 percent of the nation's adjusted gross income, but paid approximately 58.7 percent of federal individual income taxes." Sounds like some think we need more redistribution of wealth. Just remember, what the gvt gives to one group, it must take from another. We dont have a revenue problem, we have a spending problem. Since 1960 the US gvt has never had tax revenue greater than 20% of GDP. Even when the top marginal tax rates were as high as 91%. Yes, 91% in the early 1960's. It tends to stay at about 18% of GDP. People dont tend to stay in one tax bracket. They go up and down based on the economy. Hence, the Laffer curve theory (Zero tax rate and 100% tax rates yield the same tax revenue, nothing). So, grow GDP (NOT by gvt stimulus) and you will grow tax revenue. That is economics 101. Dont fall for the bobble head talking points you see on MSLSD and CNN! Think about it. If the gvt let me keep more of my money....I would spend/invest it. I might send my tranny to Eric now, rather than wait for it to die and complain that he charges too much! Sorry, I just wrote a big *************** check to Uncle Sam this weekend and I ain't happy about it! |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-17-2011 at 10:29am
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I swear to God, i am doing more and more cash transactions everyday, i believe people have switched their mindset, im getting used to saying, "on the books its this much" not because of me even though i prefer cash.
when is somebody going to complain that i dont charge enough? lol ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: Hansel
Date Posted: April-17-2011 at 1:42pm
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I just got back from a week and a half overseas where there is <7% unemployment, nationalized healthcare, great roads and infrastructure, and one of the lowest rates of national debt in the world.
And they achieve all of this with gasoline at ~$8/gallon, a top tax bracket of 45%, and 2-3 years of near universal compulsory military service (men & women) at their life's prime. Where is this fantasy land you ask? Israel. A nation completely surrounded by enemies and with few natural resources. Don't buy the hype... |
Posted By: horkn
Date Posted: April-17-2011 at 3:16pm
I'm sorry if you need to resort to name calling. It's the easy way for those that can't argue their point properly to make them feel better. I respect dave (overmyhead) and anyone else that can make their points without name calling. One thing that bothers me is how news and other sources call democrats "liberals", when the mirror image negative connotation term from republicans is repugnicans is not ever used on media? Oh, btw, I do not vote pure democratic. I vote in either direction that I see fit. You might want to state the real source of the data. It's easy to fall for fake "IRS" data. ------------- 78 martinique- refloored, reinforced, stringers re glassed, re engineered interior GT40P heads Edelbrock Performer intake acme 4 blade http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v64/horkn/fish/nautique.jpg |
Posted By: wakeboardin2k4
Date Posted: April-17-2011 at 10:31pm
Gun-driver I have been researching biodiesel for the last 6 months and am soon going to set up a little biodiesel maker at home. I have a 119 gallon hot water heater for my set up. Post some pictures of your set up. Its always cool to see other peoples designs ------------- "I'm planning to bring my girl that rides on a trailer with me and leave my girl that complains about camping at home" |
Posted By: emccallum
Date Posted: April-17-2011 at 11:32pm
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"Where is this fantasy land you ask? Israel. A nation completely surrounded by enemies and with few natural resources."
Few natural resources....including 4-5 billion dollars in US aid! Source: http://www.hotpolitics.com/tax4israel.htm |
Posted By: emccallum
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 12:18am
I could really care less how you vote...its how YOU think we need to take more of someone elses labor I have a problem with. Sources: IRS data - http://www.taxfoundation.org/news/show/250.html Top marginal tax rate - http://www.truthandpolitics.org/top-rates.php When you state such an ignorant remark as: "I think once the richest people get taxed accordingly, that all the complaining and bickering over these little issues will die out. Once the middle class don't have to pay the majority of taxes it will free up a lot more usable income." I cannot let that go without a reply. The data is very clear about who pays the bills in our country. For some reason you believe an even larger percentage of "the wealthy's" income should be confiscated so you can have your subsidized whatever. At some point those folks will say enough. Atlas will shrug! A perfect example is my rental property. My property taxes skyrocketed. To the point that it takes 2.5 months of rent to cover just the property tax. Then I pay tax on the income left over, and get minimal deductions for improvements/expenses. Guess who that increase gets passed on to?? The renter. Then everyone complains about no affordable rental property. So, your answer might be: lets get some gvt rent control and really screw up the market! Why not make gvt less intrusive in the rental market? Listen, name calling aside, republicans are just as guilty as dems, our gvt produces nothing! It is a burden to free markets, and as it continues to print money and call it Quantitative easing (QE). We are getting sold a big fat turd. Our money is going to be worthless. Their is no way we can tax our way out of this mess. We must hold our gvt responsible and force them to balance their books as we have to balance ours. Both parties. Trust me, I have not been impressed with either party for a long time. I used the term Liberal, as the "social Liberal" not affiliated with a party, but a belief that a centralized State should control many aspects of peoples life (healthcare, education, welfare, utilities, etc.). I call it like I see it. |
Posted By: Hansel
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 4:03am
That information is a decade old. That doesn't make it inaccurate, just dated. It would be nice to see something newer. Current spending by the Israeli Defense Forces is to the tune of ~$16 billion, around $3 billion of which (or ~20%) comes directly from the US. Total Israeli GDP is over $200 billion, so US military aid is equal to around 1.5% of total GDP. Interestingly even without US aid their military budget as a percent of GDP would still outstrip our own (6.5% to ~5%). My point being that US aid, while not inconsequential, does not explain why Israel can do what they do. Even if it did, there are a host of other nations around the world that do a better job of taking care of themselves than we do. I'm not saying we have to copy them, but I think that we could learn from them and do a better job of having a more equitable society. And like Tom I think that increasing taxes on the very wealthy is a good place to start. I haven't heard a single good argument yet as to why we should not. Ironically all of the rationale I hear against raising the top tax bracket is, at least to me, rooted by first principles in the fact that they are not taxed enough. For example, I would be willing to bet that if the very wealthy paid more in taxes your property taxes wouldn't have gone up in the first place, or if they did it would not be by such great a margin. So in effect you and your renters are subsidizing them. How does that sit with you? Talk about a transfer of wealth... If you are fine with that then good for you. But don't think that they aren't amassing their wealth at your expense. There are boatloads of evidence that indicate the contrary to in fact be the case. |
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 9:38am
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did you ever wonder of our alliance with Isreal? we protect them like a little brother...and we send them aid???? whatever happened to paid protection? a little blip on the map, if you ever wonder where your money ends up.... ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: emccallum
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 12:10pm
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I was not attempting to say that the US is responsible for Isreal's prosperity, or that we shouldnt support our only friend in the Middle east. Just saying that we send them a bunch of aid.
I know very little about Isreal's gvt. But, I would be willing to bet they dont have DHEC, HHS, ADC (aid to dependent children), Planned Parenthood, Medicaid, Medicare, Unemployment benefits, OSHO, Office of refugee resettlement, etc etc. In case you didnt read my other post. Historically, raising taxes has NOT created revenues above 20% of GDP. Even when marginal tax rates are as high as 91%. That is sourced in an above post. But do your own search "marginal tax rates and GDP". Tax revenues tend to run about 18% of GDP. Why not try and grow GDP? That would be the smart thing to do! How do you do that? You set people free to invest and invent. It is pretty simple, if you work in the field all day, and I take half your crop, pretty soon you not be willing to do all the work and give me half the rewards. Do we need to update our tax codes? Yes, it needs to be fair. Not progressive. When 45% of all workers in the US pay ZERO federal income tax ( http://money.cnn.com/2011/04/14/pf/taxes/who_pays_income_taxes/index.htm?hpt=T2 ) we have a serious problem. Or when those that pay no income tax get a tax rebate. Everyone must have some skin in the game. The class warfare trap you are falling into is just what they want you to do. That way you never look at the gvt as the problem. We have a spending problem, not a revenue problem. We must curb spending and the size and scope of gvt, then allow Americans to do what we used to do best....work and enjoy the fruits of our labor! |
Posted By: malcolm2
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 12:24pm
WHY NOT? Be selfish for a second. What if the highest tax rate was again 95% on every penny you made over $200K. Circa 1960 it was just that. Would you work hard to make $300K? Hell no! So if everyone making millions and millions was suddenly taxed so that they only made $200K, would they work hard to make a million $. Double hell no. People that create jobs by going out on a limb and building a business have a goal to make lots and lots of money, not just $200K. You can't create very many worth-while jobs on $200K. THINK about the big picture, not just that your neighbor makes more than you! Leave YOUR cave, kill something and drag it home! Don't be mad 'cause your neighbor did it. |
Posted By: emccallum
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 1:54pm
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Malcom2,
Thanks for input. Also, if you run a small business (Sub Chapter S ) all the profit flows down to your personal tax return. Lets say you have a good year, and really dont need to invest in any large equipment purchases (section 179 deductions), and you have kept expenses low. Guess what? All that income flows right down to your personal tax return. You cant put it aside, hold on to it just in case. All of a sudden you are "rich"! Then, they require you to pay next years estimated taxes based on last years great year. At 110%. So, this is a killer for small business, which is the bread and butter of our job creators. I run a business in this situation. I could grow and hire a few more employees. But, there is no way I am going to stick my neck out in this environment, at this stage in my life. I have no idea what tax burden is on the horizon, healthcare mandates, employee costs, etc. I am sitting on the sidelines taking good care of my current employees and making sure my family is secure. I am scared to take it to the next level. That my friend is the reality of small business in the US. |
Posted By: Hansel
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 4:58pm
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Hi Ernest,
I am sure that you know more about running and operating a small business than I ever will. I think I follow your argument, and I can find little wrong with it. I want to make it clear that I am NOT for raising taxes on small business owners. I am also NOT for raising taxes on middle to low income Americans. I am not really even in favor of raising taxes on people who make $1 million a year. I am talking about people who make tens, to hundreds, to even billions of dollars annually paying a lower tax rate than you and I. Just think about this; if you made $50,000 at year for 50 years you would gross $2.5 million in lifetime earnings. To make a billion dollars you would have to work like that for 400 lifetimes, or 20,000 years. Let's even be generous and say you make $1 million annually... It would still take you 1000 years or 20 lifetimes of working to make $1 billion. People that make that much money are not even in the same universe as us. Failure to tax them is leading directly to revenue shortfalls as I have pointed out. We have a spending problem in part, not in whole but in part, because we fail to collect from them what we could an I believe should. I stand by that statement and that is where I am going to leave it. I tire of these endless debates... I am pretty sure that I can see your point of view and I agree in principle and in practice with much of what you say. Can you not see some truth in my position as well? Why does it always have to be one way or the other. We need to cut spending AND raise taxes. It is the only reasonable way forward. |
Posted By: malcolm2
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 5:55pm
I also tire of this debate, but people need to know.....you know the top bracket is 35% for MFJ at $379K. So if you make 1 million then you are taxed 35 cents on every dollar over $379K or $217,000 in tax for that $621,000 you earned over $379K. That sounds like a very unfair share to me. Over 22% for his total AGI. http://www.moneychimp.com/features/tax_brackets.htm You should spend some time and find out how many people fall into the "earned $1 million a year" category you are so jealous of. You would find that there aren't that many people out there that you want to subsidize the rest of us. |
Posted By: wakeboardin2k4
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 6:24pm
Enjoying this discussion ------------- "I'm planning to bring my girl that rides on a trailer with me and leave my girl that complains about camping at home" |
Posted By: harddock
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 6:40pm
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It is propoganda and Fuzzy math. The wealthy ( making over $250K ) is not just Warren Buffet, Donald Trump, and all the executives of wall street. It includes every small buisiness that makes over $250 K. That amount doesen't take long for a company with 10 - 50 employees, in some businesses even less. If your company is about to be penalized for doing good they will not have the capital to get bigger and or more competitive. Real big companies can then swallow them up and use their offshore factories to make the goods which leave unemployement.
Unemployment is another area where the government tries to distort the facts. Say 2 million people get laid off in 2008 and can collect for 52 weeks. Then they are off the books. Another 2 million in 2009 get laid off but the government has 2 million coming off the books. In reality we now have 4 million out of work but we wrote off 2 million and because they aren't collecting the governmnet pretends they are working and claim they created 2 million new jobs. It is all just Fuzzy math ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=4487" rel="nofollow - 1998 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: 62 wood
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 6:49pm
...and I am just trying to figure out the $4/gallon gas... which by the way isnt quite there yet... most local stations went to 3.99.9 this morning ... dang they missed an opportunity. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1117&sort=&pagenum=6" rel="nofollow - 64 American Skier 62 Classic.. 73 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: sweet77
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 7:02pm
I bought gas today and paid $3.69  ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5528&sort=&pagenum=1" rel="nofollow - 76 Nautique "If you do what you always did,You'll get what you always got!" "An empty wagon makes t |
Posted By: sweet77
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 7:16pm
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Maybe my math is wrong. im not very smart but i thunk in 1970 you could buy a brand new car for about 2800.00 bucks, now a new car is close to 28000.00 buck thats 100% increase i think now a gallon of gas was about .36 and now its 3.70 which is about 102% increase give or take a few dollars so my question is why is everyone aggravated at the government and oil companies and not at the auto manufactures who have increased there prices just as much and most of THEM took bailout money. once again i dont like to see $100.00 go down the tube just like everyone else but the price of everything has went up. The only thing that i see that is really skewed is the average income in1970 was around 10k a year for an average household ......I think .....i just pulled these numbers off of a census report now the average income is around 43k which once again is around 43% increase if my numbers are right which they could be.... i see something terribly wrong here but what do i know??? ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5528&sort=&pagenum=1" rel="nofollow - 76 Nautique "If you do what you always did,You'll get what you always got!" "An empty wagon makes t |
Posted By: sweet77
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 7:22pm
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someone tell me if im off so ill know id like to learn more about where my money really goes and to also find out where to draw MY political line in the sand ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5528&sort=&pagenum=1" rel="nofollow - 76 Nautique "If you do what you always did,You'll get what you always got!" "An empty wagon makes t |
Posted By: 62 wood
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 8:06pm
My parents bought a new 21" color tv with the optional remote control(yep you used to have to pay extra for a remote..LOL) back in 1969. That tv cost over a grand... you can buy a pretty NICE one today with that grand! Technology and option wise, todays $28,000 cars are NOT even close to what we bought in 1970. $2,800 in 1970 bought you a modest car(Malibu,Skylark, etc.). the options were AC, power windows, and maybe an AM-FM radio. Even with the price increase of the cars, it was GRADUAL, not in a few months. My point is, in the past our econmomy had been based on "cost of living" increases.. usually modest 3-6%/year. And it was pretty even across the board. I DONT see that here... And your "spot on" with wage increases not keeping pace with the cost of living for the middle class.. . ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1117&sort=&pagenum=6" rel="nofollow - 64 American Skier 62 Classic.. 73 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: Hansel
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 9:16pm
I'll give you one guess as to where all the economic gains over the last few decades have been going. Not to sound like a broken record but, you guessed it, the top of the income ladder took the vast majority... http://www.stateofworkingamerica.org/pages/interactive#/?start=2003&end=2008 - See wealth change for yourself. I just want to clarify here, as I did on another thread a while back, that my opinions and beliefs are NOT rooted in jealousy or envy as many of you seem to suspect. I have a good job with benefits and live a far more comfortable life than I deserve. Why is raising taxes always automatically off the table? Especially at a time of supposed "shared sacrifice?" |
Posted By: wingwrench
Date Posted: April-18-2011 at 9:37pm
Then don't rely on left leaning Soros funded organizations for your information. They get money from OSI. Raising taxes to solve this problem no different than going to your boss and asking for a raise because you maxed out your credit cards and bought a house and car you can't afford to pay for. Try it and let us know how it works out. |