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1988 dash rewiring problems

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    Posted: May-26-2022 at 3:17pm
Over the winter I decided to rewire the ground wires on my ‘88 2001 to try and solve some low voltage problems I’ve been having the last few years.  I’m an amateur electrician but after a lot of reading I figured this is a project I could undertake myself.  

I decided to increase the wire gauge and remove the daisy chain completely.  On each gauge I tied together the ground wires for the gauge and corresponding gauge light and ran those to a negative terminal block.  I also redid the ground wires for the tach and one remaining speedo.  I tied in all the switch grounds together and ran those to the negative terminal block also.

Today I connected everything and clearly I did something wrong.  I’m getting all sorts of weird things. When I turn the battery on, a couple gauges get pegged, random lights turn on when switches are turned on.  The clock is the only thing that seems to work properly but it stops when I turn on switches.

Currently I’m looking back at the wiring diagram and going through each gauge with the multimeter to try and figure out where I went wrong but would greatly appreciate any help if anyone has some advice.  Was I wrong to take out the daisy chain and run each gauge ground individually?

Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRBenj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2022 at 5:30pm
Not wrong… but obviously you need to double check your connections. I can’t speak to the accuracy or helpfulness of the wiring diagram- but here are a few tips.

Start with the senders coming from the engine harness. Make sure they go to the right gauges. Add fuel sender.

Check 12v batt power (and orange alt wire, if your harness has one) and make sure it comes in to the dash via the ign breaker, then goes to a 12v buss. From the buss it should go to the key switch (Batt) and to any switch that should work while the key is off. Lights, bilge, blower, etc. Outputs of those switches should go to to those components. Lights on the gauges should be fed by the light switch.

You didn’t mention a buss for ignition power but it will be one of the more useful things to add. It should be fed by the ign terminal of the key switch. Outputs should go to the engine harness, and to every gauge +. Also to any switch that you only want to work with the key on.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2022 at 7:36pm
It sounds like you only played with ground wiring and didn't really touch any power or sender wiring to the switches, gauges etc.

It also reminds me of trailer light wiring when a ground connection gets bad and you get all kinds of wierd things happening, like you put on the left turn signal and the brake lights come on or the right turn signal flashes dimly as just a couple examples of the wierdness,  but it a lot like what's happening to you

.If you have a bad ground, the current looks for the next easiest place to eventually get to ground and things happen that make no sense at all.Wink

Where did you connect the new wire supplying your ground terminal block to? Somewhere at the engine block or maybe the battery?

I'd check the connections to be clean and tight on the new wire and on every ground wire you have under the dash 

Also check the battery negative connection to the block and at the battery itself. clean and tight.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2022 at 9:54pm
Everything worked before I began the process, I was just having some voltage drops when the system was loaded.  After reading about grounding issues I decided to start there and if that didn’t fix the problem then trouble shoot from there.  That said, I’m working under the assumption that all the senders and power are correct still.

I went over the wiring diagram and think I found at least one issue, I’ll post some pictures in a separate post.

Thanks for the help
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2022 at 9:59pm
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

It sounds like you only played with ground wiring and didn't really touch any power or sender wiring to the switches, gauges etc.

It also reminds me of trailer light wiring when a ground connection gets bad and you get all kinds of wierd things happening, like you put on the left turn signal and the brake lights come on or the right turn signal flashes dimly as just a couple examples of the wierdness,  but it a lot like what's happening to you

.If you have a bad ground, the current looks for the next easiest place to eventually get to ground and things happen that make no sense at all.Wink

Where did you connect the new wire supplying your ground terminal block to? Somewhere at the engine block or maybe the battery?

I'd check the connections to be clean and tight on the new wire and on every ground wire you have under the dash 

Also check the battery negative connection to the block and at the battery itself. clean and tight.


I connected the new ground wire supplying the terminal block back to the battery, would it make a difference running it back to the engine block?

The battery itself and connections are clean, I’ll check the battery negative connection to the engine block tomorrow.  

Thanks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-26-2022 at 11:09pm
This is the wiring diagram.  I am wondering about the two switch connections I have circled in red.  This is the Bilge Auto switch.  Should the red wire that goes to the harness be connected in these two areas?  I didn’t think so, that didn’t make logical sense to me.

Currently I have it wired like this


So it looks like I at least need to add a jumper between the bilge auto and the bilge manual switches according to the original diagram.  I’m not convinced this will solve all my issues though but it’s a start I guess. 

Any thoughts?  Thanks


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-27-2022 at 6:32am
Originally posted by gibson1525 gibson1525 wrote:

This is the wiring diagram.  I am wondering about the two switch connections I have circled in red.  This is the Bilge Auto switch.  Should the red wire that goes to the harness be connected in these two areas?  I didn’t think so, that didn’t make logical sense to me.


So it looks like I at least need to add a jumper between the bilge auto and the bilge manual switches according to the original diagram.  I’m not convinced this will solve all my issues though but it’s a start I guess. 

Any thoughts?  Thanks



Don't let what seems logical to you get in the way here..........restore the wiring to what the diagram shows for your auto and manual switches for the bilge pump  It's what was there before, then you changed it and had some "unexpected" results

Bilge pump switches and wiring don't exactly fall into the logical category Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-27-2022 at 7:16am
Haha, good advice. I’ll rewire that part today and see if I have any luck
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-08-2023 at 9:07pm
After a long break I’m back at it looking to fix my electrical.

I took voltage readings from the ignition following the daisy chain along the power supply to the gauges and here’s what I got from my multimeter readings:
-Battery-11.8
-Ignition-11.4
-Volt-7.5
-PSI-6.4
-Temp-Varies between 0-6.4
-Tach-11.4
-Fuel-6.6
-Hour-11.4
-Clock-6.5

I’m confused why the tach and hour gauges would be at 11.4v and the gauges before them in the daisy chain are lower in voltage
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-19-2023 at 6:42pm
I finally made some forward progress this weekend.  After some trouble shooting with the multimeter I figured out my idiotic mistake that caused several hours of headache.  I replaced my terminal block with a larger one and failed to realize it didn’t have a common connection so not everything was getting grounded.

After fixing that issue, almost everything has gone back to working order.  My only electrical issue now is that both the bilge auto and bilge manual switches turn on the bilge pump and the light indicator for the bilge manual switch.  I have it wired according the wiring diagram best I can tell, although the diagram isn’t the clearest.  If anyone has a picture of how theirs is wired or has any expertise I’d appreciate any help.

Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-19-2023 at 8:14pm
After blowing up your diagrams, staring at them till I was bug eyed and half blind because of the blurriness, I think I like the way you rewired it before some schmuck( AKA me) said to wire it back to the diagram last year. Wink

Now with the ground side of things fixed, I'll guess that you have a pump with 3 wires, maybe Brown Red (or Brown/White) and Black

Black to ground

Brown to Manual switch on dash

Red to Auto switch on dash

And no interconnection/jumper between the switches other than the daisy chained power input wiring

In other words take out your jumper and see if everything works

If that doesn't work...............what is the pump brand and model? Integrated float switch or separate switch?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-19-2023 at 10:31pm
I too have stared at that diagram until half blind.  I finally ended up wiring it as follows (which as best as I can tell is how it is shown in the wiring diagram)

red power input coming from the ignition switch going to pump manual and then going onto the pump auto and then going on to the other side to the bottom acc. 

Brown coming out of pump manual going to a harness, black coming from the same terminal and going to the pump auto and then to the pump auto light.

The pump manual light is directly connected to the red going to the harness

                  

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-19-2023 at 10:48pm
My pump does have three wires coming out of it, I haven’t traced them to see exactly where they run but they way you have suggested (and the way I was going to wire it last year) makes more logical sense than the way I have it now.  I’m going to try this and see what happens.  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-20-2023 at 7:10am
.Sounds like a reasonable plan

Oh and by the way, clean up that bilge sailor.  Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-20-2023 at 11:37am
Haha, Yes sir, it’s on the list
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-20-2023 at 4:54pm
1/2 cup of Dawn dish soap and 5-6 gals of water in the bilge.  Drive boat around for 15 min (even on trailer).  Empty and rinse.  Bilge is clean and shiny.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-20-2023 at 5:03pm
Originally posted by gibson1525 gibson1525 wrote:

My pump does have three wires coming out of it, I haven’t traced them to see exactly where they run but they way you have suggested (and the way I was going to wire it last year) makes more logical sense than the way I have it now.  I’m going to try this and see what happens.  


If your plan doesn't work, this picture might lead me to asking a few questions.

If it does work, I'll probably still have a few questions but that can wait.Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Morfoot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2023 at 5:48am
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

Oh and by the way, clean up that bilge sailor.  Wink

Originally posted by gibson1525 gibson1525 wrote:

Haha, Yes sir, it’s on the list

For real Man!

I ski and swim in that Lake so I don't wanna swim in your bilge Funk! Tongue
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2023 at 6:53am
Originally posted by Morfoot Morfoot wrote:

Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

Oh and by the way, clean up that bilge sailor.  Wink


Originally posted by gibson1525 gibson1525 wrote:

Haha, Yes sir, it’s on the list


For real Man!

I ski and swim in that Lake so I don't wanna swim in your bilge Funk! Tongue


Haha, definitely. I’m ashamed:)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2023 at 2:01pm
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:







After blowing up your diagrams, staring at them till I was bug eyed and half blind because of the blurriness, I think I like the way you rewired it before some schmuck( AKA me) said to wire it back to the diagram last year. Wink

Now with the ground side of things fixed, I'll guess that you have a pump with 3 wires, maybe Brown Red (or Brown/White) and Black

Black to ground

Brown to Manual switch on dash

Red to Auto switch on dash

And no interconnection/jumper between the switches other than the daisy chained power input wiring

In other words take out your jumper and see if everything works

If that doesn't work...............what is the pump brand and model? Integrated float switch or separate switch?








Well that configuration did it, I have an almost fully functioning electrical system again, much appreciate so the help!

The clock doesn’t work but I’m taking this as a win for now. I’ll tackle that later
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2023 at 6:00pm
Good job, you did all the work................. now it's time to check out that clock, the bilge can wait  Wink

I'd pull the positive and negative from the back of the clock and take 2 little jumper wires one from the negative terminal to ground and the other from the positive terminal to 12 volts (like at the batt connection on the ignition switch) and see if it works so you can decide if it's a wiring issue or a dead clock.

Is that a white faced clock or a black one. In your dash thread it looks white but maybe it's just a funny reflection or something.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-21-2023 at 6:12pm

Just an oh by the way now that things work.................. it's hard to tell from the picture but with the separate float switch and pump, I'd guess that the pump has 2 wires and the switch has 2 wires.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-24-2023 at 1:21pm
I’ve got 11.5v to the clock with the current wiring and the same with running jumpers from the ignition and back to the battery.  The clock was working during this project, could I have done something to fry it or is this just bad timing?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-24-2023 at 1:22pm
It’s a black face clock
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-24-2023 at 3:39pm
Does it look like this one?


If so, this one is desperately looking for a new home in a good looking dash.

I think yours qualifies, so send me a PM and it'll show up at your house next week Wink

It came from a Supra and thought a new life in a CC might be nice

Since it may work for 10 minutes or 10 years or something in between, I can't see charging anything for it.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-24-2023 at 9:34pm
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:


Does it look like this one?


If so, this one is desperately looking for a new home in a good looking dash.

I think yours qualifies, so send me a PM and it'll show up at your house next week Wink

It came from a Supra and thought a new life in a CC might be nice

Since it may work for 10 minutes or 10 years or something in between, I can't see charging anything for it.






Yep that’s it, I’ll send a PM

On a side note, has anyone ever had success rebuilding these clocks? A quick google search makes it seem possible
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-31-2023 at 11:41am
The new clock is in, much thanks to KENO.  I changed the impeller and was able to get it started in the driveway.  It still runs great despite sitting for 2 years.  While I was running it I noticed that the volt meter never went above 8.  It worked before I started this whole project but always sat around10-11.  With the ignition off, the needle rests on the far left.  


With the ignition in the run position it jumps to 8


I’ve got good voltage to the volt gauge, I’m assuming this means I’ve now got a bad gauge?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March-31-2023 at 1:53pm
I'd probably do pretty much what you did with the clock and unwire the voltmeter and run jumpers to it direct from the battery and see if it reads battery voltage. You could compare it to a reading on a multimeter hooked to the battery..

That would tell you if you have any wiring/ground issues associated with the gauge wiring, and whether the gauge reads accurately.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gibson1525 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-02-2023 at 10:27pm
Yep, dead gauge.  Guess I’ll keep an eye out for one.

But for now I’m getting the dash back together so I can move on to last few things so I can get the boat back in the water.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-03-2023 at 8:09pm
Sounds like the gauges are winning Wink

The rest of the gauge set that the clock came from found a home in another boat a while back, otherwise there would be another package headed south..
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