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Baileys140 View Drop Down
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    Posted: June-11-2020 at 4:21pm
I need some help. im a new boat owner. i just bought a 1995 ski nautique with 5.8L engine it. i changed out the spark plugs and changed the oil in it when i first got it. i took it out on a small lake last night and it ran really good for about 30 mins and i was planing across the lake at 45mph and all the sudden it died and i couldnt get it started at all. i had to paddle all the way back. any suggestions? my thought it could be distributor cap, spark plug wires, fuel pump or igntion control module any thought will be greatly apprcetiated
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-11-2020 at 5:10pm
Bailey,
The first thing to check when the engine suddenly stops running is the safety lanyard. Plug it in and check for continuity.

Welcome to CCfan. Stick around and enjoy the great site.


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77 Tique

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baileys140 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-11-2020 at 5:32pm
I checked the saftey kill switch. it was on tight.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-11-2020 at 5:58pm
Originally posted by Baileys140 Baileys140 wrote:

I checked the saftey kill switch. it was on tight.

Tight physically but how about electrical continuity?
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Bailey,
Plug it in and check for continuity.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baileys140 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-11-2020 at 8:56pm
I havent looked at the safety kill switch anymore. i took cap off distributor and rotor was in pieces.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-11-2020 at 9:35pm
Originally posted by Baileys140 Baileys140 wrote:

I havent looked at the safety kill switch anymore. i took cap off distributor and rotor was in pieces.

Well, for a change, that was an easy find. Now the next question is why did it break?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baileys140 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-12-2020 at 10:48am
the lady i bought it from said it was happening last year as well but she didnt say if she replaced the rotor or not. it doesnt look like she did but i just wonder how it wouldve drove decent on the lake with a worn rotor before it all together died on me
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GottaSki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-12-2020 at 11:03am
odd, Check for looseness of the shaft, maybe the bushings are ***************ged out. or looks wherever misalignments with the cap can occur
"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baileys140 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-16-2020 at 11:15am
is there a certain kind of distributor to get when buying one for a 351w? ive seen some reverse rotaiton ones or can i get a regualar one
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-16-2020 at 11:55am
Since all marine 351W engines aren't the same and the only thing known about yours is that it's a 95 that means ......................more info needed

Is this a carburetor equipped engine or a fuel injected engine? In 95 there were both and there were definite ignition system and engine differences. Fuel injection was more popular at that time.

If you could tell more about the engine or post a picture of it, showing the distributor, that would get you some answers. Pictures of the transmission showing the ID tag on it would be good too.

Sorta sounds like a rotor replacement wasn't the cure for your problem.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baileys140 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-17-2020 at 1:21pm
its a carbureated engine and i dont think rotor replacement was fix ethier. the engine is a 5.8L and says pcm all over it but it doesnt have the dress up kit like the GT-40. when i replaced the rotor it ran decent but not good. it felt like it was misfiring on a cylinder and at full throttle i still didnt have abunch of power. my next step is to replace distributor and sparkplug wires. my guages dont work so im unsure of temp im running at. but when i took it out on the lake last time it didnt die at idle or under throttle and it started right up. to me idle seems really slow. any advice or things to look for would be greatly apprciated.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baileys140 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-17-2020 at 1:22pm
i hooked my water hose up to the water intake and didnt look like i had any water leaks so i dont think its overheating but i definietly could be wrong
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-17-2020 at 1:55pm
Bailey,
As Tom mentioned above, have you had a chance to check if the distributor shaft is loose at the top from a bad bushing causing the rotor to run out?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baileys140 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-17-2020 at 2:00pm
I will check distributor when i get home to check for loosness thanks guys. when i took the cap off of distributor internal compents looked pretty warn out and corroded. i guess timing springs could have rusted out causing engine to run bad
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-17-2020 at 2:44pm
Bailey,
It's pretty common to see corrosion inside the distributor. The most important clean up and lube is on the advance mechanism. Make sure it's moving freely. Don't worry about loose springs as they are loose normally when the RPM's are zero.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baileys140 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-17-2020 at 3:08pm
do these engines have a fuel filter? my old 95 F150 had a fuel filter coming from the gas tank in the fuel line. i figure that would be another component just to replace. cheap easy fix. it looks like a canister with two stems coming off it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-18-2020 at 2:20am
As your rotor came apart at high RPMs, you may have other distributor damage. As mentioned above, inspect your distributor for wobble, wear and the advance mechanism for proper function and lubrication.

Your boat may have a fuel filter / water separator. You may have to take the clamshell engine box off to access the fuel filter. Check on the port side of the engine compartment. It may be mounted at or below the floor level near the transmission. If your 1995 is similar to my 1994, it will look similar to a canister oil filter.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baileys140 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-15-2020 at 3:38pm
update: I got a pertronix flame thrower dist and had it professionally installed. mine is 351w pcm 1995 all stock except for dist. Does this engine come equipped with a raw water pump from the factory and could not changing the impeller cause issues?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jonny Quest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 11:33am
Yes, your engine has a raw water pump. The RWP sucks up the lake water or the sea water for engine cooling. Inside of the RWP, there is a rubber impeller. If the impeller is old, cracked or worn, then the pump will not pump efficiently. The result is typically overheating issues. The RWP impeller should be inspected at least annually. In my boats, I change the impeller every two years — a bit of overkill, but it’s cheap insurance in my book.

And, no, the RWP won’t affect the distributor as the two systems are unrelated.  It’s like saying that a flat tire made the power windows stop working.  Unrelated. The RWP will certainly impact operating temperature of the engine, and high temps can and will impact other engine systems. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 1:25pm
Any boat with a raw water pump should not be started without water, either from the lake or from a garden hose .  If the RWP is run dry the vanes in the pump can tear off and cause blockages in the coolant hoses.
I also change the impeller every 2 years.  For $35 and 30 minutes labor you can trust it to work every time.  Always carry a spare in the boat.   Call it insurance for great days on the water!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GottaSki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 2:33pm
also, to add, just because its in tack doesnt mean its effective

the suction power comes from the vanes wanting to spring back to shape

once it takes on a set and hardens up, its effectiveness at pulling water goes way down.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote uncle-buck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 3:43pm
Ditto to what GottaSki wrote.
Replace that raw water pump impeller now and every year or two and save yourself lots of aggravation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 4:09pm
There are many who have fallen to the hype from the impeller manufaturers who love to sell impellers. Then there's me: 

Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

 
I've never blown one nor do I remove them for layup. This every 2 years is way overkill BS in my mind. These impellers (dual pocket) were still fine after 17 years



I changed them before I took the X55 to GL.
 

I feel those who have blown impellers have run them dry. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 6:41pm
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

There are many who have fallen to the hype from the impeller manufaturers who love to sell impellers. Then there's me: 

Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

 
I've never blown one nor do I remove them for layup. This every 2 years is way overkill BS in my mind. These impellers (dual pocket) were still fine after 17 years



I changed them before I took the X55 to GL.
 

I feel those who have blown impellers have run them dry. 

Pete Here's a quote from you in 2010 with the same picture. There's obviously some  BS being spread by you.

Get your sheet (as the Mexicans would say it) straight Wink

Those are 2 fairly ugly looking impellers too.
 

Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

I've made several comments regarding the practice of frequent impeller change being unneeded. I'm on my 29th year of owning my 1964 with the 312. I just opened up the pump to take a look at the impellers after at least 25 years. I really wouldn't have bothered since I had no cooling problems but the bottoms of the hoses at the pump where getting real bad. (soft/gooey from the RV antifreeze) No broken blades, some wear on the tips, some "set" on the blades but no set at the cam from winter storage and some blade warpage. 

 

 

The bottom line is running them dry is the killer and the marina's are spreading BS all over.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 7:03pm
Pete, I believe your comment is true but I also believe it is true where you live.
The hotter states are much harder on impellers than the cooler states. We probably have 90 days over 90* and another 70 over 80*.  Equal to about 3 or 4 of your summers every year.
Every time I try for 3 seasons on an impeller in CA I pay the price with impeller failure.  My local boating buddies follow the same advice.  I will stick with every two years in CA.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 7:58pm
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

 

Those are 2 fairly ugly looking impellers too.

 

Ugly? If you say so, but here's the key:
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

  
I had no cooling problems 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GottaSki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 9:27pm
Glad we're into boats and not airplanes
"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing."

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 9:31pm
Originally posted by GottaSki GottaSki wrote:

Glad were into boats and not airplanes

You airplane guys are always funny. I suppose you follow Sherwoods maintenance schedule to the letter?  LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slmskrs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 10:56pm
Originally posted by MrMcD MrMcD wrote:

Every time I try for 3 seasons on an impeller in CA I pay the price with impeller failure.  My local boating buddies follow the same advice.  I will stick with every two years in CA.

In my old '96 (purchased new), I ran the first impeller to about 450hrs before it disintegrated out in the California Delta at a slalom course.  Had a spare and was skiing again in 20 minutes.  Next one lasted another 400+hrs and it disintegrated at Santa Clara County Water Ski Club's site.  20 minutes later I was skiing again.

Is two years (or 200hrs which is what I do now) overkill?  Sure.  Was it smart to just run it until they died?  No!  It was stupid.  I could have clogged up channels in the engine with rubber, etc. or otherwise screwed up the engine.  While I always have the spare and the tools to do it in the boat, why do I want to risk overheating, not to mention disrupting a day on the boat?  

I agree, cheap insurance.

However, we can talk RWPs and impellers all day, but without a working gauge, we don't know.  After oil pressure, temp gauge is the most critical and I would not run my engine without both working.

And since the RWP has nothing to do with an exploding rotor, the pump and impeller are 'possible' additional issues.

I'd figure out the rotor issue (check with shaft play as mentioned).  See if there is any rubbing/wear indications inside the cap (was the cap seated properly?).

You said the lady you bought it from said 'it' was happening last year.  What is 'it'?  Rotors decimating themselves?  Or just occasional rough running/missing?  If the rotors have been trashing themselves, I would have wanted to get that resolved before buying the boat.  But that's water under the bridge.  Let's figure out the rotor/distributor issue first.

I'd then get the temp gauge fixed (I'm assuming the oil pressure gauge is working, if not, fix that first and then the temp gauge).  If none of your gauges are working, could be a ground or power issue in the dash, but I would not drive blind.

BTW, does your boat have the top center dash 'check engine' light?  If so (and those sensors are working), you do have back up temp and oil pressure notification/limp mode.  But get those gauges fixed!  :)


Gordon '97 Ski Nautique, GT40
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slmskrs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-16-2020 at 11:05pm
BTW, a VERY easy/quick way to determine if your impeller is working or not (I do this every time I replace it) is:

As soon as I start the engine, I immediately put my hand on the BACKSIDE of the RWP.  If it is not pumping water, it will get HOT very quickly due the impeller friction.  If water is flowing, it will stay cool.  Quickest way to check the pump/impeller.  Of course, if the impeller has disintegrated, that may not work unless there are still a couple of vanes turning against the housing.

Pix of the check engine light:


Gordon '97 Ski Nautique, GT40
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