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Poor Man's GT40 Diagnosis

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Bri892001 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December-21-2017 at 2:14pm
Ok, I updated the spreadsheet.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roymiz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-18-2018 at 11:51am
No start (OK, it'd start 1 out of 50 tries) caused by bad cell in the battery.
Even when jumped off another battery, the bad primary battery (only have a cranking battery in my boat) was wreaking havoc on the fuel delivery in some way.

Thought for sure, it was fuel pump/relay related...

Nonetheless, worth sharing...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blamey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April-22-2018 at 12:35am
Originally posted by roymiz roymiz wrote:

No start (OK, it'd start 1 out of 50 tries) caused by bad cell in the battery.
Even when jumped off another battery, the bad primary battery (only have a cranking battery in my boat) was wreaking havoc on the fuel delivery in some way.

Thought for sure, it was fuel pump/relay related...

Nonetheless, worth sharing. thanks..


Got any more details, this may be my issue. Low battery, jumped off another battery. Cranks but doesn't start.
96 Super Sport
Previously: 95 Sport Nautique, 1980 Ski Supreme
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chicoman88 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-10-2018 at 1:54am
I bought a 98' Ski Nautique this year that had not been used much in recent years. The seller had it de-winterized before putting it up for sale and said it ran great (of course). I got it and the second time I had it out it died on me after it had been run for a while and warmed up. Then I started it back up and it immediately died. Started it again, it did its initial up-rev and died again. Then on the 3rd or 4th time it started and kept running like normal.
I thought maybe it was bad fuel from sitting for quite some time and not being used much, so I topped it off with new fuel and added sea foam for the next trip out. It went without incident.
A couple weeks later we were headed out again and backed down the ramp to launch and the boat would start, do its rev-up and then immediately die. Repeat about 6 times.
It finally started and ran like normal so we headed across the lake to our spot (about a 5-10 minute drive). About 100 yards away from the beach it cuts out and dies. Then I re-start it, it starts, revs up and immediately dies. Repeat 6 or 8 times. Then it starts and runs like a champ until the end of the day, when the cycle repeats again.
The problem is sporadic and impossible to duplicate. So far I've replaced both fuel relays and the fuel filter but couldn't get out before the weather turned to see if that fixed it. Both fuel pumps seem to be running fine as you can hear them fine when you turn the key. I'm pretty confident it's not the kill switch.
Another notable trait is that it seems to rev higher and longer than it should upon initial start-up, and takes a while to come back down to normal running rpm. I'm not sure if that's related or not. I know the GT-40's, and most others, do rev a bit on start up, but it seems higher and longer than normal.
Other options I'm checking into further are the anti siphon valve and the idle air control
Update:
I went to get my boat ready for summer today after it was winterized. I replaced the emergency kill switch today just in case it was an issue too. Put new belts on and went to start it up and... it started and revved up for a second and turned itself back off. After repeating that several times it would not stay running. It starts, revs for a second and shuts itself off. I replaced the battery terminals and put a new connection on the wire coming off the positive terminal, as I’’d heard that was a common problem (called the stay run wire or something like that). Still no luck, it continues to start and then shut itself off. I checked the fuel pressure, it’s at 40 when it pressures up and goes to 45 when it fires and then goes back to 40.
Seems like maybe the computer is shutting it off. It doesn’t have a crank position sensor.
Any other suggestions?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-10-2018 at 8:45am
A few things for you

First you really should start your own thread instead of tacking on to this one. This one is supposed to be for listing solutions. Cut and paste this into a new thread

Second It sounds like you made things worse (but more consistent) with your kill switch replacement, Why don't you bypass it temporarily with a jumper wire and see how things act

Here's a thread in the link down below with lots of info that won't all pertain to your problem but it's informative. His problem was the ECM, hopefully yours is easier and cheaper.

There's a GT 40 service manual in the reference section that you may or may not know about.

You mention both fuel pump relays being replaced. It's really one ECM relay and one relay for the fuel pumps, but you can find this in the manual It takes 2 good ones for the engine to run, it sounds like you have that covered with 2 new ones that didn't help your problem

link
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote broden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-27-2018 at 12:16pm
I downloaded your spreadsheet on the GT-40.
I have a 1994 Hydrodyne grand sport, it has the GT-40 pro boss, great engine.
These Nautique forum's are the best place I can find about the GT-40 and the Hot start problem.
I've had the boat about 20 years, maybe the last 7 it's had the hot start problem.
I've tried a few things on the spreadsheet before and will try to go through the rest and hopefully get it fixed.
Thanks
BB

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Keuka 95 GT40 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-29-2018 at 11:27am
I need to replace the water pump in my 1995 Ski Nautique (GT40).   any info available on correct pump to use and pictures of install ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June-30-2018 at 2:19am
Originally posted by Keuka 95 GT40 Keuka 95 GT40 wrote:

I need to replace the water pump in my 1995 Ski Nautique (GT40).   any info available on correct pump to use and pictures of install ?


Would this be the raw water pump or the engine circulation pump??

Assuming you're referring to the circulation pump, new are available at Nautique parts.com or Skidim.com - they are different than the automotive versions:



Same dot coms have the Sherwood raw water pumps or rebuild kits for them, if yours is in fact a Sherwood pump:

JCCI
1995 Ski Nautique GT40
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Bri892001 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-02-2018 at 11:27am
I don't believe either the raw water pump or circulation pump are GT-40 specific.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-12-2018 at 7:18pm
No start condition solved by replacing all fuel injectors. These were injectors that had not been run in a while:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=42984&PN=1&title=fuel-pumps-not-kicking-on

Updated Spreadsheet

"Fyi, they're $200 a piece at nautique parts or $262 for a whole set from carquest.
https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/accel-fuel-injector-performance-150824/22904432-P?searchTerm=fuel+injector"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ALLAN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-27-2018 at 7:46am
HELLO RECHERCHE PHOTO GOUVERNAIL OU SAFRAN DEMONTAGE ET REMONTAGE DU PRESSE ETOUP MERCI CORRECT CRAFT 99 SN
ALLAN
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-27-2018 at 9:01am
Originally posted by ALLAN ALLAN wrote:

HELLO RECHERCHE PHOTO GOUVERNAIL OU SAFRAN DEMONTAGE ET REMONTAGE DU PRESSE ETOUP MERCI CORRECT CRAFT 99 SN


Ok, who speaks French that could interpret?


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Keep it original, Pete
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 8122pbrainard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-27-2018 at 9:05am
Originally posted by 8122pbrainard 8122pbrainard wrote:

Originally posted by ALLAN ALLAN wrote:

HELLO RECHERCHE PHOTO GOUVERNAIL OU SAFRAN DEMONTAGE ET REMONTAGE DU PRESSE ETOUP MERCI CORRECT CRAFT 99 SN


Ok, who speaks French that could interpret?


I found an online translation:

"HELLO Search PHOTO rudder or rudder dismantling and reassembling the press ETOUP Thank you"

Now I'm really confused!


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Keep it original, Pete
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gt40KS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-27-2018 at 10:52am
Different online translator:

HELLO SEARCH PHOTO RUDDER OR RUDDER DISASSEMBLY AND REASSEMBLY OF THE PRESS ETOUP THANK YOU CORRECT CRAFT 99 SN

So I think there is some grammar/ syntax issues that the online translators don't perceive
JCCI
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wetskier2000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-27-2018 at 3:33pm
miss while driving and sometimes would barely run, FIXED with a new Hall Effect Sensor.

Hall Effect, Distributor fix
Current: 1997 Nautique

Previous: 1987 Nautique

          1964 American Skier
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-27-2018 at 3:38pm
Ok, I updated the spreadsheet under complete/rebuilt distributor:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17VemuIOaa9i8kEply-ZmFOSyjyzz8rd7B0WEuIT_6S0/edit?usp=sharing

Glad you found the fix
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-06-2018 at 1:41pm
1995, pre fuel cell, multiport, fuel injected GT40 intermittent start, cough and die problem solved by new Carter High Pressure Fuel Pump, (along with new LPP and Fuel Filter) as described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=43326&title=1995-start-cough-die-problem-solved

Created a new row in spreadsheet:
High Pressure
Pump (Non FCC)

and logged it in the Rough idle and stalling column
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-06-2018 at 1:45pm
Pre-FCC boat Fuel Starvation issue solved by FCC conversion as described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=39174&PID=555615#555615
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-15-2018 at 4:46pm
New high pressure fuel pump solves intermittent cold, crank and no start condition as described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=42358&title=gt40-crank-no-start-crank-again-and-it-fires

Logged in the spreadsheet in the Hard Cold Start column
and High Pressure Pump (non FCC) row.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17VemuIOaa9i8kEply-ZmFOSyjyzz8rd7B0WEuIT_6S0/edit?usp=sharing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rrichr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-24-2018 at 11:23am
2001' GT40
No Start - keypad shuts off when attempting to start or turn any accessory on, turn auto bilge off and keypad cannot be activated.

Resolution: loose ground on block at front starboard of block (I checked 3 different ground points with the other 2 on either side of the back of the block). Apparently there was enough ground from the bilge to at least activate the keypad but not near enough to power anything else.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote man0seven Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-02-2019 at 7:59pm
I know that is is more of a collaborative thread but I would really be interested in seeing resources for more cost effective parts. Sometimes the only place I can find a part is White Lake or SkiDim and both see to charge a premium for commonly available parts.

While on the subject: Can anyone point me to another source for the ACT and the ECT?
ACT - 12A697
ECT - 12a648
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-02-2019 at 9:37pm
I do have a partial list of part numbers from the marine division of Ford. Many are the same that are on automotive 5.0 and 5.8’s, some Cobra R’s and Lightning’s. I’d look them up but I have no idea what those acronyms are.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-02-2019 at 9:52pm
Originally posted by Gary S Gary S wrote:

I do have a partial list of part numbers from the marine division of Ford. Many are the same that are on automotive 5.0 and 5.8’s, some Cobra R’s and Lightning’s. I’d look them up but I have no idea what those acronyms are.


One of them is the Air Charge Temperature sensor and the other is the Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote man0seven Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-02-2019 at 10:09pm
Originally posted by KENO KENO wrote:

Originally posted by Gary S Gary S wrote:

I do have a partial list of part numbers from the marine division of Ford. Many are the same that are on automotive 5.0 and 5.8’s, some Cobra R’s and Lightning’s. I’d look them up but I have no idea what those acronyms are.


One of them is the Air Charge Temperature sensor and the other is the Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor


Thanks!! Yes, what Ken said.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Gary S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-02-2019 at 10:53pm
Sensor Air Charge Temperature - F2DZ-12A697-A
Sensor Engine Coolant Temperature- F2AZ-12A648-A
For example-
Link 1

Link 2
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-04-2019 at 11:38am
Battery Box Fuse causes intermittent hesitation and no start as described here:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=41558&PN=2&title=gt40-intermittent-loss-of-power-at-speed

Sheet updated as well.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote workky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July-15-2019 at 12:17pm
Had anyone ever had an issue with the water temp sensor? The one that goes to the computer and tells it how cold or warm the engine is
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2001SAN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September-27-2019 at 4:08am
Hi Brian,

A couple of recent experiences both contributing to a no start but a different reason in each case.

1) Initially fuel pumps would prime but solenoid just clicked but starter wouldn't spin. Starter assist solenoid replacement cured this.

2) Intermittently, even after this the fuel pumps wouldn't prime when ignition turned on. Faulty battery kill switch solved this.

Back to full health.

D.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cboland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-27-2020 at 11:01am
Problem: No start when hot.
Fix: Replace low pressure fuel pump.

Problem: Rolling/oscillating idle at startup when hot.
Fix: New MAP sensor.
Bud

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bri892001 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May-27-2020 at 3:32pm
Originally posted by 2001SAN 2001SAN wrote:

Hi Brian,

....

D.


Cool, thanks, spreadsheet updated.
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