1963 Correct Craft w/ 198 Buick, Help!
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: Repairs and Maintenance
Forum Name: Engine Repair
Forum Discription: Engine problems and solutions
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7376
Printed Date: April-28-2024 at 1:45am
Topic: 1963 Correct Craft w/ 198 Buick, Help!
Posted By: Boat Bob
Subject: 1963 Correct Craft w/ 198 Buick, Help!
Date Posted: July-06-2007 at 9:33am
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Hi, I am in the process of buying a 1963 Correct Craft 16' American Skier, It has a Buick 198 Fireball V-6 engine which looks to be a counter rotating/Left hand rotation motor. The heads on the motor are cracked severly externally(Most likely, so is the block, although so far, I see no outside evidence of that) so I'm considering replacing the engine with something else.
My question is, I have some mercruiser motors laying around(I'm a Marine Service dealer, but mostly fool with Outboards and I/O's, I don't do much straight Inboard work) I have a 140HP 3.0 GM 4 Cylinder, a V-8 Ford 302, and a V-8 350 260 HP Chevy motor. What's my best option for a replacement motor? Try to find a left hand rotation motor of some sort? or will the trans(Velvet Drive) go either direction with a prop change, so that I could use a right hand motor? Would the Gear ratio on the trans be different as per motor being used, or is that a boat weight issue, or HP issue? Being that from what I can find out, the Buick 198 was only used (In cars at least) from 1961 to 1963, I'm assuming that trying to find one of these either in good shape, or in repairable shape might be a real problem, not to mention the part costs if I would have to rebuild one, so I'm thinking switching to something else is the way to go. What do you think? There are Marine salvage yards in the area that will have the bellhousings and such for me to be able to round up the marine conversion pieces, I think(Bellhousings and such) Are there any other varibles that I'm missing or should be considering? Will most engines fit under the cover as it was made originally? I imagine I can fabricate any mounts that may be needed. Thanks in advance for your time and for any info you choose to provide! Bob Lemley Bob's Marine 2918 Saint Andrews Drive Findlay, Ohio 45840 419-722-2533 ------------- Bob Lemley |
Replies:
Posted By: eric lavine
Date Posted: July-06-2007 at 10:20am
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Your pretty close to me Bob, Im in Medina, If you have the room i would go with the 350 chevy, easy to obtain parts, good useable power (better more than not enough)
Alot of guys here will say keep it original and i agree to a cartain extent, that depends on what your intentions are. I say update and make it reliable ------------- "the things you own will start to own you" |
Posted By: GottaSki
Date Posted: July-06-2007 at 11:06am
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BTW Lefthand is std rotation.
Of course the 350 has the most power of the bunch, but the 302 is significanly narrower, shorter and lighter, and can spin good rpms that will be effective on the small boat. consider some al manifilds . Beware those narrow boats are more sensitive to rotation changes so beware. If you run alone, you may want to keep it reverse rot. If you are most often with passengers to balance it, you may get away with std rot. The ratio is 1:1 direct, all tweeks are in the prop design, and go beyond just dia and pitch. ------------- "There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worthwhile as messing around with boats...simply messing." River Rat to Mole |
Posted By: 63 Skier
Date Posted: July-15-2007 at 3:00am
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Hello Bob. I have the same boat with the 198 Buick. Mine is original and has been very reliable.
I thought I'd comment on the performance so you have a baseline to work with. The 198 is a little screamer of a V6, good torque, pulls slalom skiers OK, about 40 mph top speed with me alone in the boat. Its a great cruising engine too, runs easy at slow planing speeds, doesn't burn much gas. Having said all that, a bit more power would be a good thing if you intend to ski with a few people on board. I've skied in a late '60's version, same 16 ft. hull with a 302. It pulled skiers up much easier and held speed better than my V6. The 350 might be a bit of overkill in this boat, and a bit heavy, the 302 a better match. You ought to stay with left rotation, otherwise you'll be running alone with quite a list to port. ------------- '63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: July-15-2007 at 9:37pm
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Bob, The 198/225 V6 wasn't as rare in cars and boats as you think. Jeep bought it from Buick and used it for many years and ended up selling it back to Buick who changed the firing order to smooth it out. Universal, OMC and even Chris Craft marinized the block so it went into quite a lot of boats.
Gotta ski is correct in warning you on the narrower hulls of the 60's. The 350 would be way to much engine given the length of the boat.(of coarse our own boat doc and reid p will tell me different!!) V 8's in the era were the 283's so the 302 wouldn't be a bad choice how ever you will be adding weight and only maybe only 60 HP. The V6 was a high performance engine in it's time. 150 HP out of 198 CI with the weight of a 6 isn't bad! I just got back from the CCfan reunion and one of the guys had his American skier there It came from the factory with the 170 CI (100 HP) Ford inline 6. The boat's performance is great!! If I were you, I would investigate the 198/225's problems farther and consider the repair. If you do decide to re power, I would recommend nothing bigger than the 302. Is this your boat or a customers? What condition is it in? how's the floor and stringers for rot? I'd hate to see you drop in a V 8 and have nothing to bolt it to!!! ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: July-16-2007 at 10:11am
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Bob, The following link is from the for sale classifieds on marinengine.com
http://www.marineengine.com/cgi-bin/suite/classifieds/classifieds.cgi?request=detail&id=12684&category_id=104&sub_id=1021&variable_file=inboardoutboardengines.variables&group=1&set=1&position=8&total_count=45&website=default&prev_action=display_sub_list&session=$session - parting out OMC 225 V6 ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: 63 Skier
Date Posted: July-16-2007 at 11:53am
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I had asked here about how similar the 198 and 225 are, and got the answer that there are quite a few differences between the engines. Heres the link to that thread:
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5003&KW=Super+Sabre - http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5003&KW=Super+Sabre I only mention it so you won't think you can match parts from the 198 you have and the 225. If the 225 is in running condition it would be a great upgrade, a bit more HP. ------------- '63 American Skier - '98 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: July-16-2007 at 12:54pm
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I'd bet that the external components like the bell housing and manifolds would bolt up.
Bob, I did a "buick V6" search not too long ago and it took me to a site that had the compleat history of the engine. There is actually a V6 following! The "fireball" is a series of engines made by Graymarine. I'm not aware of them having marinized the V6 block but could be wrong. Are you sure it's not a Universal? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buick_V6_engine - history of V6 EDIT: I just found that Buick had the "fireball" name as well. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: 68Sportsman
Date Posted: July-17-2007 at 1:38am
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HI,
I have the 198 in a 68 (might be older) correct craft sportsman. It runs great and is easy on the gas. If this one over goes, I'll probably just order up a crate engine to replace it, shouldn't be too expensive, Peter ------------- Peter |
Posted By: bkhallpass
Date Posted: July-17-2007 at 2:54am
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Peter, I'd like to see a picture of that Sportsman. BKH ------------- Livin' the Dream |
Posted By: RainDog
Date Posted: July-17-2007 at 8:25pm
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If you are considering keeping it original, http://www.graymarineparts.com - GrayMarineParts has a ton of original NOS parts. Their website sucks and they don't seem to respond to emails, but when I called them, they were really helpful and sent out gaskets for my Fireball V8-215 AMC 327 motor the same day.
------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1868&sort=&pagenum=1 - 62 Classic http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5242&sort=&pagenum=1 - 2002 Super Air |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: July-17-2007 at 10:23pm
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Steve, I think he has the Universal engine and not the Gray but he hasn't come back with the answer. He refered to the "fireball" because as I found out, Buick called some of their engines that too. Had me confused!
I'm assuming you made it home and back to normal!! It's tough after a great weekend. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: RainDog
Date Posted: July-18-2007 at 2:32am
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Doh!
I was thinking of the aluminum 215 cu in Buick V8 that Gray used. Except driving at night in my perscription sunglasses, we made it home without issue. Hubs are not heating up but the squeaking springs are driving me mad. All of 90 miles. I'm soooo brave.  ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1868&sort=&pagenum=1 - 62 Classic http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5242&sort=&pagenum=1 - 2002 Super Air |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: July-18-2007 at 8:03am
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Spray some LPS #2 between the leaves!! The coil springs and shocks on the little Atom trailer make it so smooth that I forget it's back there. My Dunphy trailer which I was told was one of the first Mastercraft copies of a CC trailer I re sprung. It rode hard due to the light load (1900lbs) so I put on lighter springs but put on mono springs. They are 1 leaf which is tapered in thickness. I really like them. You may consider this at some time since I'll bet you too are over sprung. Two 2000lb axels and springs for a total of 4000? The classic can't weigh more than 2500. What did that trailer salesman want to OVER sell you? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |