rudder adjustment possible?
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: Repairs and Maintenance
Forum Name: Boat Maintenance
Forum Discription: Discuss maintenance of your Correct Craft
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=34804
Printed Date: May-05-2024 at 4:15am
Topic: rudder adjustment possible?
Posted By: cbr1000dude
Subject: rudder adjustment possible?
Date Posted: October-21-2014 at 11:51pm
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Now that I can finally drive my 1988 Barefoot, I noticed it steers fine to port, but not far enough to starboard. Looking at the rudder, it does go way over to the left, but about half as much to the right. My 90 SN has equal left to right turning. I tried moving the steering cable housing more forward in the clamp. This worked, but created another problem, the cable comes out of the housing so far, it hangs up going back in. The larger diameter part of the cable end gets jammed. The smaller diameter part sticks out about 1 inch when the left/right steering is equal. Nothing is bent or hard to turn. I just can't see how else to adjust it. Is this a Barefoot thing? The cable 82-90 is the 17 1/2 foot $300 one, but this doesn't seem to be the problem anyway. I did notch the support aluminum brace for the removeable floor piece (just aft of the motor box) so the cable could get a better angle at full port turn, and leave the cable about 1/4 inch forward in it's mount, so it's a little more equal, and doesn't jam. Is there anything else I can do? |
Replies:
Posted By: phatsat67
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 11:02am
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To adjust the throw you need to loosen the 4 clamp block bolts and slide the steering support tube in the direction you wish to attain more rudder movement. Someone possibly used a shorter throw steering support tube? ------------- |
Posted By: cbr1000dude
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 11:16am
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Thanks for the reply. I'm pretty sure it's the original cable and support tube, but I'll measure the one on my 90 SN for comparison asap. Glad to know moving the tube in the clamp is how it's suppose to work. |
Posted By: DayTony
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 11:23am
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The boat will always naturally turn better in one direction than another because of the trail of the prop being it a RH or LH rotation. Im going to have to agree you may have the wrong cable in there. If i recall i read somewhere that CC uses a CC specific throw cable(please correct me if im wrong) i think it has a couple extra inches over standard supplied cables. Thats why the women like the nautiques better. It doeant make sense to remove it iust to measure it if the cable and helm are performing good. Usually the part number is stamped into the hard plastic coating before to ends of the cable Might be worth referencing and cross checking to see iwhat you have in there. OR Maybe the cable was removed from the helm and not put back in correctly which may limit in one direction and allow overthrow in another. ------------- 1988 Barefoot nautique-454 |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 12:10pm
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Zach nailed it... The only way that the symptoms you're describing can happen is if a specialty CC (82-90 long throw) cable is used with a "standard" clamp tube. The cc cable requires a longer clamp tube, about 2" difference IIRC. I posted a picture in our BFN rebuild thread as we put a long throw cable in our 79 and then discovered we needed a special clamp tube. We found one from Don in FL, they aren't available through normal channels AFAIK. No one I spoke to knew what the heck I was talking about! I'm betting a previous owner changed the cable and forgot to save the old clamp tube- then bought a new standard tube to replace it. Probably had to limit cable travel (by setting unequal travel and allowing the tiller arm to hit the transom before the cable popped out of the tube) to make the boat functional! 
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Posted By: Gary S
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 12:28pm
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If you cannot find one I'd bet you could make one,it is after all a pipe thread on the end correct? If it is it must be pipe not tube. A place like on line metals would have it,you'd just have to thread it ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1711&sort=&pagenum=1&yrstart=1966&yrend=1970" rel="nofollow - 69 Mustang HM SS 95 Nautique Super Sport |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 1:25pm
I would think you could sister on an extension opposite the threaded side if really needed. ------------- |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 1:33pm
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It looks like aluminum or stainless pipe - confirm the material. http://www.mcmaster.com/#aluminum-pipe-nipples/=u9hh6c" rel="nofollow - Mcmaster aluminum pipe nipples threaded both ends http://www.mcmaster.com/#stainless-steel-pipe-nipples/=u9jwwo" rel="nofollow - stainless pipe nipples From the picture, it looks like 1/2" which will be about 7/8" O.D. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: cbr1000dude
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 5:11pm
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Wow, you guys really know your CCs! That's exactly what it was, long throw cable with short throw support tube. The PO must have had the cable replaced with the wrong support tube. No wonder it still worked so well, my 87 SN cable was stiff as a board when I replaced it as few years ago. Thanks for the heads up. So I made a 2 inch "sister" connection with aluminum tubing, water hose and hose clamps I had. You can see the mark on the support tube where I moved it 2 inches forward for equal rudder throw. Works great. 
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Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 5:20pm
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I would get that fixed the right way pronto. Likelihood of that joint failing is low but if it does, and the cable falls out the end, then you're essentially stuck at full lock. That would be a serious safety concern, depending on the conditions under which it fails! FYI, the clamp tube does not generally get replaced with the cable... You must remember to remove it from your old one and install it on the new one. I'm betting the PO forgot to save it and had to buy a new (too short) replacement after the fact. Just a guess. |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 5:35pm
NG, I too suggest getting a proper fix. I agree with Tim that even though chances of failure are low, the consequences could be serious. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
cbr1000dude wrote:Posted By: cbr1000dude
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 10:52pm
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Just had it out on the water, and it turns both ways better. The Barefoot has a poor stock set up IMHO due to the restriction in movement of the swiveling clamp caused by the floor support aluminum brace. It keeps the cable from moving where it needs to go as the angle changes when the rudder arm moves forward. Look at the angle of the support tube in my photo. It was unable to do that without the notch I made in the brace. This keeps it from jamming sideways and making it harder to turn full starboard. I can feel the difference. Yes, a proper length support tube will be the next fix, I just wanted to get it out in the water and see if it made any difference in handling, before it gets too cold and rainy. I'm happy with the improvement. Oh, and I checked the top speed with my Iphone speed box, 46 mostly, 49 in a glassy section. Seems about average for a 454 from what I've read. |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: October-22-2014 at 11:39pm
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Tim is just very against modifying the factory steering equipment. ------------- |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-23-2014 at 12:25am
 ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: IAughtNaut
Date Posted: October-23-2014 at 1:33am
------------- bring the ruckus http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5347" rel="nofollow - 2000 Pro Air |
Posted By: seacamper
Date Posted: November-23-2014 at 10:56pm
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So I am having similar problems on a 75 SN, the rudder deflects about 40 degrees one way and 20ish degrees the other. If the clamp tube was a bit longer, I think I could even out the throw. The problem is I think the cable would then smack the transom. Any ideas? ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: November-23-2014 at 11:10pm
Tom, Can you post a picture of the clamp tube and it's mounting. Is there any evidence that the tube mount position has been changed? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: November-23-2014 at 11:11pm
NG, Did you do a proper fix yet? ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: seacamper
Date Posted: November-24-2014 at 12:17am
Hey Pete, I know the cable was replaced recently. The clamp appears to be in the original spot. I can post photo tomorrow. It looks like I need to replace the clamp, because the clamp bracket is broken. I guess I need to make sure they put in the right cable! ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: November-24-2014 at 11:05am
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The 75 should have a standard length cable and tube. Fix what's broken and do some adjusting. ------------- |
Posted By: seacamper
Date Posted: November-24-2014 at 10:44pm
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OK Guys, Here are some pics: The tube: Does this look like the right tube? The cable is teleflex 41331. is that correct?? http://s266.photobucket.com/user/turninggrey/media/IMG_0177.jpg.html" rel="nofollow">  http://s266.photobucket.com/user/turninggrey/media/IMG_0177.jpg.html" rel="nofollow"> http://s266.photobucket.com/user/turninggrey/media/IMG_0178.jpg.html" rel="nofollow">  The cable holder: It defiantly needs to be replaced. After a cleanup, it looks like there was a reinforcement done to the attach point (probably due to forcing a worn out cable) http://s266.photobucket.com/user/turninggrey/media/IMG_0181.jpg.html" rel="nofollow">  Wiring going to the stern: Yellow is to stern light, red is to gas tank, is the green (which is taped off attached to nothing) to my non existent blower? http://s266.photobucket.com/user/turninggrey/media/IMG_0179.jpg.html" rel="nofollow">  Thanks Guys Tom ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: November-25-2014 at 10:34am
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Tom, Since the clamp block was broken at one time, it comes to mind that maybe the boat took an underwater hit. Take a look at the tiller arm for any signs of bending. If bent, that would explain why the arm would hit the transom and the reason the cable tube is adjusted all the way aft in the clamp block. Also make sure the tiller arm isn't upside down. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: November-25-2014 at 11:21am
He never said the cable hits the transom. That's actually the direction it needs to go, but he just thinks it may end up hitting by the time it the steering gets evened out. The more the tube goes back the more it will limit steering in the other direction, so it's really a "give and take" situation where you really only need to go half as much as you think you need to. Moving the block back will accomplish this. With that "repair" it's possible the block got moved back. It wouldn't take much to screw it up. Most boats of that vintage seem to have the tube really hanging out the back already anyway. http://s134.photobucket.com/user/kfleisch/media/Correct%20Craft/IMG_1005.jpg.html" rel="nofollow">  And besides, even if the tiller arm was bent or upside down if it was hitting the transom already it's clearly not going to get adjusted back any further! ------------- |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: November-25-2014 at 12:05pm
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As far as actual length of the steering tube, I don't know. Call Zach? I don't recall any hard measurements posted other than there is a long one and a short one... Follow the other end of the green wire to see where it goes. It could be another ground. Brian Mullins has a green ground jumper wire from the stern light socket to his (plastic) fuel sending unit. Perhaps back in the day they ran it all the way back to ground instead of daisy chaining like they sure liked to do in the 80s and 90s! ------------- |
Posted By: Bri892001
Date Posted: November-25-2014 at 12:28pm
This is the setup Hollywood is talking about on mine:
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Posted By: seacamper
Date Posted: November-25-2014 at 4:15pm
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Ahhh. That makes sense now because there was a green and black wire loose back there. Funny thing is the fuel gauge works. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
Posted By: seacamper
Date Posted: November-25-2014 at 4:21pm
Ding Ding Ding! Winner. I thought it was supposed to have a bend! I heated it up, and tapped and pried it back into shape and its a pretty even throw. I am just guessing it was a 7 to 9 degree bend, and I bent it back to original plus 3 (just to make sure I had the throw, and it is all good. You could make a Budweiser "Real Men of Genius" commercial from this forum. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: November-25-2014 at 5:05pm
Tom, In order for the gauge to work, it has to be grounded. You need to do more investigating on the ground wiring! Don't forget the fuel fill needs to be grounded as well. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: Bri892001
Date Posted: November-25-2014 at 6:40pm
| I'm wondering if it's a metal fuel tank, and the tank itself is grounded somewhere else? |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: November-25-2014 at 6:57pm
Are you sure yellow is stern light? That should be the blower. Red is fuel sender. Black should be ground. I vaguely remember the stern light wiring going under the gunnels, not through bilge, because it is all pre-wired to the deck upside down before attaching to the hull. Bent tiller arm? Wow, must have been some wreck! That doesn't seem plausible to me but it's been 40 years... ------------- |
Posted By: seacamper
Date Posted: November-25-2014 at 10:23pm
I'll chase the wiring around tomorrow. These boats are sure easy to work on! I should have taken pics of the tiller before I bashed it back into shape. ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |
Posted By: seacamper
Date Posted: November-30-2014 at 6:24pm
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It was the green wire. The blower is now functional. Thanks. Tom ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique Boat Bar 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Open Bow 1988 Mastercraft Tristar Closed Bow 1969 Seacamper Houseboat 1986 Harris Pontoon 2004 Seadoo GTX SC + Flydive Xboard 1999 Adventurecraft |