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Shaft Packing Nut Warm / Alignment question

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utahdave View Drop Down
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    Posted: November-17-2019 at 10:14pm
Hey Gang,
2014 Nautique 200 closed bow
6.0 L engine
1799 hours
I have owned the boat since Dec 2015 (2nd owner, promo boat, purchased w/1360 hr).

I did a short lake test today after replacing a cutless bearing about 10 days ago and finally getting everything put back together this morning.

In the cutless process, I removed the shaft (mine is dual taper from factory).
Shaft was checked for straightness using V-block / dial indicator method. Passed w/ nothing more that .0015 variation.

Once the new cutless was installed, I slid the shaft in, and it was riding very low in the metal thru-hull log. I ended up removing the strut, shimming the rear 2 bolts w/ one stainless washer each, test fit, got the shaft in the center of the log and re-bedded with 4200.

At that point, I used a v-block to find the "happy spot" where the shaft turns most freely, supported it with the v-block, put the coupler on the shaft (I tightened the nut that holds the coupler to snug, but not completely tight, b/c I needed to remove the coupler to install the rubber log hose & and packing nuts. I left them off the boat at this point so that I could continue to monitor where the shaft was riding in the log. With the shaft coupler installed, I aligned the engine / trans / coupler to the shaft coupler to within .002 with feeler gauges.

At this point, I noticed 2 things:
1. The engine was pretty high on the front engine mounts. There were enough threads to get the nut on, but not the lock washer.
2. When I removed the shaft coupler and installed the shaft rubber log hose and brass nuts, no matter where I put the hose clamps, or how much I fiddled with it, it seemed to force the shaft down a bit from the "happy spot." The shaft packing (new, 1/4" teflon coated rope) seemed to be playing the largest role in forcing the shaft down.

At this point, I elected to lower the front and back of the engine to the spot the shaft seemed to want to ride and re-aligned engine / trans to shaft to within .002 After that, I secured all the engine mount bolts, and re-checked alignment (it was the same as above).

This morning, I re-installed the prop and rudder, and went to the lake.
Stut seal, rudder seemed to do fine.

I put the motor box in the boat, and left the rear center floor out of the boat so I could watch for water leaks. That part went pretty well.

I had read that it is helpful to "break-in" the packing by driving the boat at 20 mph for about a minute and then coming to rest in the water to see how much the packing is dripping and tighten / loosen as needed. When I put my hand on the brass packing assembly, it was warm. I could wrap my hand around it and hold onto it for about 6 seconds before the amount of heat being transferred through my skin was too warm. I backed off the packing nut several more times such that it was dripping 1 drip every 6-7 seconds, and did another short drive test. Prior to each new drive test, I put a cool rag on the brass packing assembly to cool it off, verified it was cool with my hand, and then did a new "driving test." The final drive, the upper nut was so loose, it must have only been hanging on by one thread b/c when I moved the nut below it, it slid above the threads.

So I am wondering:
1. What are your thoughts about the log hose and packing nuts to lowering the shaft from the "happy spot?" Remember, when aligned to the happy spot, the engine was pretty high on the mounts.

2. Is it normal for the brass packing nut to be warm? I never put my hand on it prior to today. Inside the packing nut, I put 3 separate rings of the 1/4" teflon rope. When I took it apart, there were 3 rings of the old rope in there.

Other thoughts?

Thank you,
Dave




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KENO View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-18-2019 at 7:54am
Originally posted by utahdave utahdave wrote:


So I am wondering:
1. What are your thoughts about the log hose and packing nuts to lowering the shaft from the "happy spot?" Remember, when aligned to the happy spot, the engine was pretty high on the mounts.

2. Is it normal for the brass packing nut to be warm? I never put my hand on it prior to today. Inside the packing nut, I put 3 separate rings of the 1/4" teflon rope. When I took it apart, there were 3 rings of the old rope in there.

Other thoughts?

Thank you,
Dave


I think that if you're satisfied with the alignment and the shaft is pretty well centered in the log, you're good to go.

How much effort did it take to turn the prop by hand when everything was back together?

As far as the packing, why not take one ring out and give yourself some thread engagement for the gland nut?

Then you'll maybe be in your "Happy Spot" with good alignment and a cool packing gland.

Last time I used the teflon stuff, I started loose on the nut with some expected leakage, tightened the nut in increments to get a drip every once in a great while and it ran cool to the touch.

You could keep your hand on the gland indefinitely





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Mpost View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-18-2019 at 9:15am
Dave,
   2. ?
I had a similar issue when I packed my 98 SN this summer with 1/4' gore. I believe I tightened it too much to start with and one I did that I could not get enough water thru to cool the shaft. I replaced the 1/4' with 3/16" Teflon and started loose. Here is the post for my issue.
link
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zwoobah Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-18-2019 at 1:31pm
Thanks for posting this, and thanks for the link to your expreience Mpost. I need to re-do my packing this coming spring, and I will make sure to leave it loose then tighten once in the water.
1968 Mustang 16 - 351W powered
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-18-2019 at 7:49pm
I had trouble adjusting mine at first also.   In the garage I made the mistake of tightening the new packing by hand before the water test. That was too tight and I could not get it to lubricate properly which caused heat. Had to pull the packing back out and reinstall it less packed. Worked fine on second try but we took our time on the water, maybe 2 hours playing with it to get 6-10 drips per minute while running in gear.
I wish I knew a shortcut to this process so I could do it in the garage and be done.

Now 100 hours later it is starting to take on a little water if left overnight, for the first 50 hours it took on zero water left over night so I will need to tighten the nut a little for next year. On a 4 day camp trip I probably took on 3 gallons total with the boat in the water the entire time so it is not bad but it was better and can be again.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrMcD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-18-2019 at 7:59pm
Your question about the Log, I have read on this forum that not all logs were mounted perfectly so some shafts will not be centered in the log but they can't touch the shaft.
I would be concerned if you engine mounts are not able to adjust,
Maybe someone on here knows what angle the prop shaft is supposed to be at facing the engine. It kind of sounds like your log is not centered properly and the strut angle may not be correct after adjustment? That is a guess at this point since your engine mounts could not adjust to line up with the shaft location.
The mounts are pretty flexible and should easily match to a proper shaft location.
Something is off.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote utahdave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-19-2019 at 6:17am
Alignment:
I tried to spin my prop by hand tonight. It took my whole hand and a some arm strength. That does not seem ok. My gut is with MrMcD - something is off.

If I had ground down the strut base or sanded the gelcoat where the strut attaches, that may have gotten me more clearance in the log and not required as much engine height adjustment (shaft angle changed when I shimmed it w/ washers) and when that angle difference is transferred over the 4’ approx length of the shaft, it requires a larger engine height adjustment that grinding the strut base would have. Hmmm...

Thanks for the input thus far...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KENO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-19-2019 at 6:58am
Originally posted by utahdave utahdave wrote:

Alignment:
I tried to spin my prop by hand tonight. It took my whole hand and a some arm strength. That does not seem ok. My gut is with MrMcD - something is off.

.


That's why the question was asked about how it spins.

A quick check of that after the alignment adjustment, before ever hitting the water would have told you a lot

Assuming the strut bearing was wet when you spun it?

You can also unbolt the coupling from the transmission and spin just the transmission by hand for a comparison of the effort needed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riley Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November-19-2019 at 7:12am
Just about every Correct Craft I've taken apart has had the shaft low in the log. Having the strut alignment so the shaft is in the center of the log maybe ideal, but it sounds like it won't work in your case if the engine mounts can't adjust to accommodate the change in angle. Sometimes, (this is more apt to be a problem in older boats using a thinner shaft log hose) the hose can get torqued and throw your shaft angle off and cause the shaft to bind in the strut. Try taking your packing nut off the hose and see if the shaft is in a different alignment coming out of he hose than it is coming out of he log,
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