1979 Fish Natique Help please

Perfect on the trailer doesn't mean much

One way or another you really should check the timing.

What did your friend do to get it close?

This may sound silly but how hard is it to get to #6 spark plug?

TJ59 wrote: Number 6 is very easy to get to. my friend said he took off the cap and the old rotor was pointing at number seven and he got it close to 7. He is a mechanic so I know that I'm trying. Usually I do things myself..

Sounds like just what he said, he got it close

Then if you had timing marks you could do the final timing check/adjustment.

Since #6 is easy to get to, if you were to read about using a piston stop to find TDC on #1 you could do the same procedure on #6 and mark the damper and timing cover at TDC.

With an advance type timing light, that's all you would need to check the timing

With an older type light and some timing tape for the damper, you could then do the timing check.

#6 is always at TDC on the exhaust stroke when #1 is at TDC on the compression stroke since it's the fifth piston/cylinder in the firing order, meaning the TDC markings are the same on those two cylinders.

A little tough to explain on the computer, but if your friend can do the check with a mechanical stop this will work.

With this or any other 90 degree firing V8 you can check the timing with the light hooked to #1 plug wire or to the fifth wire in the firing order and the light sees the same timing marks.

Sorta' magic but not really

TJ59 wrote: Thanks so much , this is big help when i put my finger over #6 plug hole it will push it back , i just gotta make sure its the correct stroke--- i assume it will be the stroke that has rotors pointing in the general direction of #1 since the engine starts and runs well?

If it's pushing back that means 6 is approaching TDC and the rotor would be pointed at #6 not #1.

This won't give you any more accuracy than the install job did.

If you want to accurately mark the damper and timing cover you'll need to use the piston stop method which is a lot more involved.

You know it's close already because it starts and runs, you just won't have any real idea where it's set though (other than close)

Somebody is bound to jump in and say something like "I set my timing by ear" or "I set it by adjusting for max RPM's at full throttle and back it off a little" and start a discussion or 2

They may work for those people but it's not exactly precise

TJ59 wrote: Thank you so much .. this has been very educational

And probably confusing too

TJ59, Keno gave you the best advice possible but you did not do it.
You need to buy a Piston Stop, you install the piston stop in your Spark Plug hole, #1 or #6 will work as Ken already told you.
With the piston stop in place you rotate the engine slowly using a wrench on your crankshaft where the harmonic balancer mounts. (the big pulley at the bottom of your engine) I say turn slowly and by hand because you will rotate till the piston hits the piston stop and won't rotate any more. If you do this with a starter you will break the piston and piston stop. Do it slowly by hand.
Piston stops I have used are adjustable. You can turn the stop down or up to work with many engines.   Start with the piston stop adjusted down.
With the piston up against the piston stop back off the stop, raise the stop up as you slowly advance the piston up against it.   If you back off too far the piston will rotate past and you will need to reverse your piston and lower the stop a little so you find a spot where you stop the piston close to Top Dead Center. Now you lock the stop in place and mark your timing cover and Harmonic Balancer, use tape at this point for your mark.
Mark it in a place where you can use it to check timing in the future.
Step one is done.
Next reverse rotation with your wrench and rotate the engine backwards till the piston hits the piston stop again. Once again use your tape and make the mark on your timing cover and on the harmonic balancer/crankshaft pulley.
Now you will see a gap between your two marks. The Center of this gap is TDC or Top Dead Center.   Measure carefully as TDC is very important for proper timing.
Mark your Top Dead Center clearly now that you know where it is. You might use a dremel tool and leave a permanant scratch for future use. Obviously if you use the dremel tool don't bore a hole into your engine, just leave a clear scratch or mark for future use.
This method allows you to find exact TDC quickly in an engine like yours that has no markings. You can later add the timing tab and mount it matching your TDC marks.
As far as I know ALL harmonic balancers will have a Timing line on them.
Last as Ken already advised you use a Set Back Timing Light. With one of these you can run the engine and adjust timing very accurately. These lights have a dial on the light that help you set your timing. Dial in 10 degrees on the light and run the engine. The light is advanced 10 degrees now so it will flash at your TDC mark.
Last step to verify your Advance is working proper you can dial in 34 degrees or any number you choose and run the engine up to 3,000 -4,000 RPM and see if you reach 34 degrees total advance.
Playing with this light you can watch your advance and make sure the distributor advance works smoothly and gives you the mechanical advance desired.
So at idle if you set the timing to say 10 degrees and now run up the RPMs you should find the mechanical advance moving your timing as the RPMs climb and it should max somewhere between 33 and 36 degrees advance with the engine spinning 3,000 to 4,000 RPM. Most are fully advanced by 3,300 RPM but you need to check..
Do some reading on what advance works in your 454 without problems.
If you run 2 degrees too much in a loaded boat you might burn a piston or head gasket.
This procedure is what you have to do to make sure your engine not only SOUNDS good but actually RUNS good and can work at wide open throttle without burning itself up..
Hope this helps.

i ended up getting help from a GM tech this Am and we got it spot on without timing light..my tab comes in morrow and then will check

the exact procedure you stated above by pulling the #1 and using stopper

Hey Tico, nice to see that you got some great advice from a couple of guys with a huge amount of knowledge and you took their advice. Glad to see you get it done right!

Your boat looks like it is in very nice shape, curious to hear how it performs with the 454. Is it new to you? There are not all that many of these around but the people that own them seem to really like them.

Surprised at the 13x11 prop. What is your top speed and WOT rpm? Not that top speed is a priority in that boat, but wonder if you could be turning fewer rpm at that same cruise speed and have a bit more low speed handling with more pitch.

454's are very forgiving engines, could run them at higher rpm with no oiling problems, but I agree continuous at 4,000 isn't something I would do, particularly on the ocean. I've run my 454 jet boat at 4,000 for quite a while with no issues, but I'm not exactly far from shore or help at any time.

Cruising rpm, beyond the obvious question of how quick you want to get there and how the boat is handling in the conditions, is about fuel economy. I don't know if, on a boat that big and heavy, you can be at mid 20's cruise speed and stay out of the secondaries, but it might be worth a look. The difference in fuel burn at 25 or 29 or 32 might be quite a bit different.

Sounds like you've really enjoyed the boat! If you are happy with it no need to experiment, but it might be interesting to put the other prop on, see what the rpm is at 29 mph and whether you find it runs quieter at the same speed, and do a full trip guess at fuel burn vs. the prop you have now.

My timing tab came in today and I installed it. Seems to be spot-on...only problem is the line is jumping around about an inch Every now and then. However it seems to run perfect, never seen it idol this smooth and my life.. haven't put it under a load yet. Is the light jumping around anything to be concerned with? Forgot to mention this 454 only has about 80 hours on it . You harmonic balancer. New pulley. I have a freshwater setup. Even with all motor and this one I've always noticed a slight wobble with the fresh water pump. But it is never given us problems

Smooth idle ... 650 rpms ...when the timing light is flashing the white mark on the harmonic balancer moves back and forth about an inch....at idle

I think the Timing light might be bad. I actually dropped it today LOL. Engine is running too darn good...I noticed there's a little bit of play in the distributor hole where it goes into the intake side to side movement whenever the clamp pulldown is loose.. nothing excessive just a little bit....

I hope that the case . This is a digital light . Ad a matter a fact I can watch rpms on light hold between 640-650 while the white line is moving back and fourth.. again , I did drop light earlier in day..Bosch light from AutoZone..gonna get another light today

TJ59 wrote: very educated , nice group

Hang around for a while, you'll find out most people here are stupid and mean.

Glad you found the site, looking forward to more pictures when you get a chance.