Question on used SPN
Printed From: CorrectCraftFan.com
Category: General Correct Craft Discussion
Forum Name: General Discussion
Forum Discription: Anything Correct Craft
URL: http://www.CorrectCraftFan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=39833
Printed Date: May-15-2024 at 2:57pm
Topic: Question on used SPN
Posted By: pedricd
Subject: Question on used SPN
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 1:57pm
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Sorry if this is the wrong discussion part of the site... please let me know if it is. I really want to get into a CorrectCraft if possible (MC or Bu maybe). I have a couple of sniff test questions on a used 1992 SPN I'm looking at. Interior redone by dealer 2 years ago, 375 hours on the boat. Concerns: 1 - I understand ALL 1992 Nautiques had wood stringers, the guy claims that the SPN (or this SPN) does not... I don't think that's possible (but easy to check I guess). If wood but solid, would that deter you from this boat? 2 - has the PCM 5.8 HO Pro Boss... which means Pro Tech ignition AND I'm assuming it has EFI which would not be fun to replace (i'm assuming I would have to convert to carbed). 3 - It's always been stored out of the water *except* the last two years it has been in a slip during the summer months (stored indoors fall-spring)....should I be concerned about how much deterioration this could have caused over two years? 4 - Price: he's asking 12,800... I'm thinking it's probably worth more like 10k? http://toledo.craigslist.org/boa/5748051355.html Just trying to do a quick check to see if it's worth taking a look at.... |
Replies:
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 2:03pm
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That's a high quality looking interior job. 2 years in the water isn't a big deal. The boat does look very nice, owner obviously knows how to tie it up well! It does have the ProTec ignition but there is a carburetor under there, so all you'd every have to do is get a distributor. I would definitely not be paying anywhere near $12,800. 10k seems much more appropriate. The boat DOES have wood stringers. SN usually means Ski Nautique to us. SP or SPN would clearly indicate Sport. |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 2:05pm
| Thanks for the quick reply! Yes sorry, I meant SPORT Nautique duh.... I'll try and edit... |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 2:12pm
| All gen1 sports are wood but that wouldn't deter me. It is not one of the more desirable cc hulls though, even 10k seems quite high. Make sure you ski it first to make sure it meets your expectations. No EFI until '94, that boat will be carb'd. Pro Tec is an ignition and engine protection system only. |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 2:17pm
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TRBenj - What would you think a reasonable price range would be then? I was concerned if it was EFI + Pro Tec as I understand you have to replace both if retrofitting.... If it's carbed then that makes that less of a worry. I definitely care about resale and don't want to overpay unnecessarily...I figured there was a reason the boat hadn't sold yet :). I'm thinking he thinks that it is all composite, that the interior adds thousands along with the tower/low hours.... I'm sure it will be hard to bring him down.... And BTW, you guys are AWESOME...if I end up with a nautique this seems like a great community.... |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 2:21pm
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Tower is subjective. To me it subtracts value. There's definitely a carb there, as Tim said it would't be original without one but I can see it. We're not just a CC community, savvy members with all makes and models come here for the truth! |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 2:27pm
| 8k seems closer to reality... But the new interior (nice but missing factory logos), tower and the fact that it's at a dealer are all probably inflating the value in the sellers head. |
Posted By: JPASS
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 4:07pm
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There are 2 1997 sports for sale in my area. 1 with 1345 hours is $9K, the other is asking $15500 with only 471 hours. Keep in mind these are all composite. I agree with TRBenj in regards to the $8K price tag. ------------- '92 Correctcraft Ski Nautique |
Posted By: quinner
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 4:29pm
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That is an 8k boat IMO. To just about everyone but the seller and Timmy, wood stringers are not helping it's value. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1143" rel="nofollow - Mi Bowt |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 4:32pm
| Wood stringers definitely do not help value. That said, worrying about the structure in a cradled SN is completely unnecessary, IMHO. Especially one that appears solid and well taken care of. You wouldn't believe the mushy boats held together just fine by that cradle. It's actually quite amazing. Don't be scared! |
Posted By: quinner
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 4:36pm
And with an OB, would you need to pop the cap like Okie did on his Supra??  ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1143" rel="nofollow - Mi Bowt |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 4:37pm
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Thank you guys! I started to hint to the guy that he was asking waaay too much (without trying to offend him). My budget was around 12k (maybe a bit more depending) so if I can't swing the right price on that boat I'm still hunting for another CC, MC or Bu bowrider. BTW - he just dropped to 10,500.... EDIT: Oops MC not MS... boy have I been screwing up abbreviations today! |
Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 5:15pm
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There is a lot of value to a low hour, well cared for boat with near perfect upholstery. I think a $ 9-9,500 number is closer to its general value than the $8,000 number because there is a general preference to boats with towers (though not in this community on those boats)...... but I think you REALLY need to ride and ski that boat. It will ride better and be more group/family friendly than you expect.... but it won't quite ski as well as you expect too. The trade-offs are personal choices and not CCFan or NADA determined values. It will definitely allow you to feel better about walking away from or walking toward this, or the next boat. Ski and RIDE it! ------------- https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206 http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot 78 SkiTiq |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 5:44pm
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He seems like he is his willing to come down... If I haven't mortally offended him yet, I'll probably be test driving tonight.... I threw the 8k number at him (very gently) so I'll probably end up around 9k as you stated Air206...(he stated he was lowering to 10.5k OBO on Monday then next step would be to turning it over to a broker). definitely dependent though on how the boat feels to me upon inspection/ride. It seems to fit what I am looking for...so unless I don't like the ride or something weird in the condition I'll probably jump on it...but I'm not afraid to walk away otherwise... I don't normally do any pricing over email but he was soo high in his price I didn't want to waste each other's time...thank you all for your expertise! |
Posted By: quinner
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 6:17pm
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So as not to offend blame yourself for the lowball offer, call it all you have, all the little lady is letting you spend, all your mommy will give you, whatever works, heck, start crying if you think it will get you a better deal, whatever it takes, lmao ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1143" rel="nofollow - Mi Bowt |
Posted By: rolleronariver
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 6:35pm
I purchased a 92 Sport this past spring for $8,500. My interior is a little more used then yours but still not bad. I love the wake for wake boarding and Wake surfing but, like these guys said, if you're into skiing I can understand where it might not be the best wake. The only thing mine has that this one doesn't is a nicer roswell tower and perfect pass. I'm not sure if this helps in the bargaining but it is a great boat. Mine also has more hours.  I did a lot of shopping before I bought mine. About 6 months worth and I got a good deal for $8500. Oh, I also have wood stringers. I've tested them by torquing down the engine bolts and they still seem solid. I wouldn't worry about them. If you're handy at all mechanically you can replace them yourself if you ever have trouble. ------------- 92 Sport nautique |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 6:37pm
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Howcome everyone worries about wood stringers but not engine hours? "oh, that engine has 1,000 hours better plan on tearing it apart and rebuilding soon!" df |
Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 6:55pm
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Every Excel has wooden stringers (oops did I say that out loud?). I have seen soaked Excels with severely disbonded stringer fiberglass and heavy with soaked foam that had NO evidence of issues - No waterline gel cracks - nothing. There is so much good glass (and gel) in those boats that an engine cradle distributes the weight of the engine and the rest seems fine. It's shocking to look at how good the outside is and how bad the backbone is. Like Tim and HW said don't let wood hold you back too much.......... ------------- https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206 http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot 78 SkiTiq |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-01-2016 at 7:07pm
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rolleronariver - Thanks for that feedback. That makes me a lot more comfortable in the 9-10k range depending on how it is in person... I'll let you know if I hear back from him... I might have to grovel! Ah well... |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-02-2016 at 10:32am
| Going to go look at it today sometime, I work about 10 minutes from where the boat is (every other boat is a minimum of 1.5 to 2 hours away) and if we work it out and I like it might get it done today too! |
Posted By: Dreaming
Date Posted: September-02-2016 at 1:50pm
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Cool! keep us posted. Be careful of the crazies out today! |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 11:03am
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So, I ended up going through with it! Just have been too busy with the logistics of and having fun with the boat! Ended at 9750 and think that was a fair price after checking it out and riding/driving the boat. Used it all weekend and it was awesome. I didn't do any skiing but got to wakeboard and I felt better/stronger/less tiring wakeboarding behind this boat than I did behind an I/O even when I was 10 years younger. What a world of difference. Hopefully I'll get in some slaloming before the end of the season. Pulled the kids and some friends around in a triple tube too. All around very happy about it! So...now for the "happiest days of owning a boat part"/my to do list: 1 - As I already knew, the hull was reaaaalllly grimey, I took it to a car wash immediately and got a good chunk of it off, but I'll be needing to scrub it with some chemicals (toilet boal cleaner/acid). Then buff/wax the hull. I may wait to do this until I'm done with it for the season. 2 - I clogged up BOTH speedo pitot tubes... Since there hadn't been a boat on that side of the dock for some time, the weeds were really bad and after making them into chopped salad the first couple of times, both previously working speedos stopped. I'll get in there with a small drill bit and clean 'em out. Lessen learned and shouldn't happen again (plus probably not good for the water pump/intake). impeller replacement will be done this fall regardless. 3 - The drivers seat is loose in the front from the floor. The guy always sat on the back of the seat when pulling wakeboarders and loosened it up :(.... Any advice here? I'm thinking either oversized screws or bolts or ??? 4 - Fuel gauge is erratic, probably have a sending unit in the future, but this is low priority. 5 - I backed off the idle rpms a bit (they seemed high for my taste [1k RPM]). I backed it off to about 750 RPM with the boat not in gear, is that about right? It ran fine at lower rpm but didn't want to go too far while still playing around with the boat. 6 - The trailer... TBH, and it's my fault, this was the one part that I didn't get to inspect (the trailer was 25 minutes away at a marina). I probably could have gotten another 250-500 off the price based on it but ah well... It hadn't been used in 2.5 years. So...it has one bad wheel bearing (i'll probably replace both along with seals). It has some surface rust on the fenders and on some of the supports around the fenders (i'm sure from gravel chipping). Going to recarpet the two forward bunks (marginal). Also, not sure if there is supposed to be a hand crank to crank the boat onto the trailer, but there is a large ratchet strap there instead. My guess is there is supposed to be a crank at the bottom of the front stop support with the strap running through the guide (that is there) at the top of the support (I can see a spot there that looks like a mount?)? Sorry for the mega-post, and some of this should probably be moved to another part of these forums? Also, here is a pic of the kids in the driveway :) (after hosing down at the car wash). EDIT: Hosing down the boat not the kids ;) 
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Posted By: MechGaT
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 11:36am
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Nice looking boat! Enjoy! ------------- '92 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 11:44am
| Thanks MechGaT, you too ;).. Hopefully I can get my hull looking like yours! |
Posted By: Blamey
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 12:32pm
From the partial pic the trailer looks like a Ramlin. They usually use a metal turnbuckle as per the below pic to hold the boat on the trailer. You can get these at Nautique Parts.  ------------- 96 Super Sport Previously: 95 Sport Nautique, 1980 Ski Supreme |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 12:40pm
| That is an original correct craft trailer. Cc didnt sell off their trailer business to Ramlin until ~1995. |
Posted By: spiralhelix
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 12:55pm
Congrats on the purchase! We really love our SpN for wakeboarding and agree with it not being a good wake for slaloming...but then again I'm not trying to run a course either, so to me it's just fine. If you want a boat to slalom behind...you will end up with two boats  ------------- -Spiral '89 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 1:21pm
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Thanks guys! I'm the same way... Primarily going to wakeboard behind it, slaloming on occasion just for fun :) |
Posted By: Bri892001
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 1:52pm
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I'm on my phone, so I'll pick an easy one. 1.) Dirty Hull Bring your favorite brush, scrubby, or a long handle boat brush with you when you go to the lake. Also bring a mask and snorkel. When your out on the lake, between sets, or just relaxing, don your mask and snorkel and go to to town on the bottom. Stuff comes off a lot easier when it's wet, and there's a lot more places you can reach without the trailer in the way. |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 3:29pm
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3 - The drivers seat is loose in the front from the floor. The guy always sat on the back of the seat when pulling wakeboarders and loosened it up :(.... Any advice here? I'm thinking either oversized screws or bolts or ??? This is the biggest possible issue. As this boat had wood used in its construction quite likely that is what is under those screws and is now rotting. Might be able to do a relative small repair in the off season. Trbenj did a relatively localized repair on his 90 SN that was documented here many years back ... best bet is to tackle it sooner than later and keep the boat as dry as possible in the mean time. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 4:55pm
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Are you sure those would be screwed into stringers/wood? Seems like a bunch of screw holes would be a water intrusion point even when not loose? When I pulled one of the screws and looked at it there was no trace of wood on the screw or in the hole...but maybe I missed something? I will verify this tonight, if it *is* supposed to be into wood and there is any rot then yeah that's going to not be fun :(... My assumption was that it was just screwed into the composite floor (similar to prior plywood floored boats I have been on)....? |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 5:12pm
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Cant be sure cause that is a relatively low volume generation of that model and they could have done anything but generally in the wood stringer boats they used 1x wood stock under the fiberglass skin in the front section of the boats where the seats are. It doesn't do a whole lot but give them something to screw into... and yes its a bad place for water instrusion and became a common rot point. It is always possible they were experimenting with something else under there on the late sports of that generation but I doubt it. My experience with the V drive footers/excels is that they didn't change anything in their construction materials when they went all composite with the ski nautiques ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 9:26pm
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Went up to the lake to grab the trailer to fix the bearings. Checked the seat screw holes. Definitely all fiberglass/foam. Short screws that go just past the thickness of the fiberglass. No wonder they rip out (especially if abused). The 93s I think had a molded fiberglass base, that's probably why. I have an in between boat... Pics attached, hole and obvious lame attempt by prior owner to use plastic wall anchors on two of the screws. EDIT: Pictures uploaded, showing by far the worst hole and you can see the foam in there.... Two holes are like that, the rest are just stripped out a little bigger than the screw....   
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Posted By: Donald80SN
Date Posted: September-06-2016 at 10:47pm
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Be careful with screw length. You can run a screw through the bottom of the bottom in that area if you are not careful. A fatter screw is a temporary fix to get you through the season. Dang I just though about Quinner when I typed that (Fatter Screw). ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique SOLD Back to Cypress Gardens 2002 Sport Nautique, GT-40, FCT2, Cover Sports, Tower Bimini, Inc., Wet Sounds Audio System, Star Gazer Wake Edition S. 1968 Ski Nautique, Project. |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-07-2016 at 11:32am
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Updated prior post with pictures Yes, I checked inside the hole and there's maybe a half inch before you hit the structure. It's solid though and untouched by the screws that were there, so at least the guy didn't get longer screws and go into the hull!. I grabbed one of the screws so I could match up whatever I do with it. I'm thinking about epoxying something in there to add strength, maybe fill the holes with this and redrill: http://www.jbweld.com/products/marineweld-twin-tube I would want to make the holes/screws/mount stronger than they were when new. So might make sense to add some sort of reinforcement (aluminum plate? not sure how I'd attach, perhaps cut out some carpet and screw in AND glue/epoxy to fiberglass). I'm not too worried if I don't get to it right away based on the use it's going to get for the rest of *this* season. I just won't lean back! |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: September-07-2016 at 12:45pm
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Paul, Never-drops are shallow enough that you won't go into the hull plus utilize a machine screw. They are available in stainless as well. Forget the JB. They make the stuff for the DIY back yarder!  http://www.jbweld.com/products/marineweld-twin-tube" rel="nofollow - Here's a link to the back yard stuff!!  FYI, ANY epoxy that doesn't require precise mixing is weak. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: MechGaT
Date Posted: September-07-2016 at 7:17pm
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On my '92 the rot seemed to start at the passenger seat base screw holes. There was a thin piece of plywood under the fiberglass skin. I realized during the disassembly that the screws were different sizes. It now makes sense that someone was trying to get into solid material. Based on my boat's serial number it was made in late '91 so they could have changed the construction, but don't be surprised if you find out later there is wood under there to screw the seat base down. ------------- '92 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-07-2016 at 11:45pm
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You have a lot more experience with it than I do. I looked really hard for wood and dug around and couldn't find any. Super thin floor with foam directly underneath is what I thought I found. Maybe I mistook wood for fiberglass or will find it in another hole. The floor feels completely solid so hopefully if there is wood and no sign of rot if I patch and seal it properly there won't be an issue. I'll know fully after completely removing the seat. Also fwiw, last 4 digits of the serial number are E292 which I understand means May of 92 model year 92. |
Posted By: lewy2001
Date Posted: September-08-2016 at 12:05am
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That carpet does not look like original Correct Craft fitment. More than likely somebody has been there before you. I suspect rotted wooden floor panel may have been removed and replaced with foam and thin fiberglass floor that you now have. ------------- If you're going through hell, keep going http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2999" rel="nofollow - 89 Ski <a href="http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=5685" ta |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-08-2016 at 10:26am
| That's interesting... I asked the PO about the carpet since it looked so nice. He said he did not have it replaced. It had been stored completely dry until the last two years..and it only has 380 hours...so it's possible the carpet is orig. He also claimed the guy he bought it from (5 years prior) said the boat had composite stringers...which I questioned but since the stringers were solid I didn't worry about it. Either CC was transitioning the hulls to all composite in prep for the 93 model OR...maybe the guy he bought it from had stringer rot and had the floor and stringers redone....haven't seen anything that would indicate this...but I haven't been looking for it either... I'd love to find a contact at CC to ask if they have that detailed of information/build info by serial number.... |
Posted By: Blamey
Date Posted: September-08-2016 at 12:04pm
Since the '93 sport was a new hull design, I highly doubt that they built any '92 hulls using composite stringers. Never heard of them doing that on the ski's where the hull didn't change. ------------- 96 Super Sport Previously: 95 Sport Nautique, 1980 Ski Supreme |
pedricd wrote:Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-08-2016 at 12:32pm
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I know, conventional wisdom and their literature states that only starting in 93 did they go all composite... I should be able to figure this out by looking more closely at the boat but I won't have access until this weekend. I'm NOT drilling into the stringers to find out however... :).. Based on what I saw in the flooring, it seems like it *could* fit the integrated floor/stringer/hull construction... Fl Inboards, in another thread stated: "Actually their are a number of 91 and 92 Ski Nautiques out their with Composite stringers. They came out of the Sea worlds and a few team skiers boats. I have a 92 that was Deena's team boat with composite stringers. " http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15407 Sounds like it is very unlikely, but not impossible and he's talking ski not sport but... |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: September-08-2016 at 12:54pm
http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15407" rel="nofollow - Direct link to composite stringer thread ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-19-2016 at 11:21am
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Sorry for the gap, been busy! Some updates... First, progress on the trailer Before:  After (new bearings/seals, new bunk carpet, forward bunks new wood, ground rusted spots down and POR-15 plus top coat [everything appeared to be surface rust]):  I've removed the fenders and am getting the sandblasted because I want to completely remove the powder coat, Debating on going with diamond plate for the sides or back to carpeted wood (I could slap the original plywood on there but don't like the water retention....). Also, have cleaned up the hull of the boat (as best as I can on the trailer). Next is buff/polish/wax (gel coat appears to be in great shape but has a little oxidation towards the rear). I may pay someone to do it (buff + polish/wax I found a local place that does it for 12$/ft):  Now for the bad: 1 - You guys are right about the floor with the wood...someone may have been in there at one point and done a patch job towards the inside but it's doubtful... I pulled the seat completely last night in the dark and with the flash light I was able to check all of the holes. I did find wood... So, I'm trying to decide what to do with it. The floor appears to be solid, maybe a little soft just in the inside corner of the front-left of the seat. Would your suggestions be to cut it out and patch or should I even consider putting git rot in there? I've tried to find TRBenj's thread with the patch he did that someone alluded to but have not been able to find it? 2 - Once I cleaned up the bottom of the boat some, I noticed something I hadn't before with the output shaft. Note this picture is before I did the thorough hull cleaning with chemicals:  Now, it appears to be centered in the log and comes out straight (it's hard to tell based on the angle of the camera and taking the picture at night). And again, with some resistance, I can turn the prop with one finger (I still want to do an alignment). However, you can see that at least at some point, the shaft has rubbed against the hull. You can also see what looks like a manual routing out towards the back of the hull. I'm wondering if this came like this from the factory or, more likely, someone replaced some components and didn't center everything with the hole??? Should I be concerned about this? |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: September-19-2016 at 11:51am
| On the trailer steps, the slickest replacement I've seen is plywood coated in bed liner. Looks just like the original black carpet unless you look very closely- but no water retention. I am going to try vinyl coated ply (black nautolex) first since I already bought it. I'm just not excited about paying $100 for a sheet of 10' ply. |
Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: September-19-2016 at 12:11pm
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I did steel diamond plate...... it's nice, but noisy. I guess there's more flexing of the trailer that the wood dampens, esp on a heavier BFN. Wanted to do aluminum diamond plate like Marty's idea but wayyyyy too costly. I agree with Tim, the bed liner coated plywood looks pretty good on Donald's trailer. ------------- https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206 http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot 78 SkiTiq |
Posted By: Dreaming
Date Posted: September-19-2016 at 2:21pm
| I made a full size PDF of the pattern for those trailer steps once... If you PM me your details, I'll see if I can find it and send it to you |
Posted By: MI-nick
Date Posted: September-19-2016 at 3:07pm
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i just re-did trailer steps on my '99 SAN trailer with http://www.overtons.com/modperl/product/details.cgi?pdesc=Overtons-Tuff-Coat-Rubberized-Nonskid-Marine-Coating-gallon&i=73213" rel="nofollow - this from overton's. came out really well. used every bit of 2 quarts. had to clean the plywood really well and use a roller...we'll see how it holds up... ------------- As far as I can tell, I'm not quite sure... |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-19-2016 at 5:22pm
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Dreaming - that would be awesome! I don't think I need it yet (I have the originals and one is completely in tact and the other snapped in one spot when I was moving it around so I think I can still use those as templates)... I'll still PM you for them just in case. I am thinking about 3/4" exterior ply with the bed liner/rubberized coatings (thanks for the Overton's tip). Do you end up coating top, sides AND bottoms or leave the bottom open to "breathe" (paint where it sits on the brackets tho)? I think it's a good idea as I don't like the idea of a big rattling piece of steel back there...although it would look pretty nice. I'm guessing you sand down/route the corners to give the ply a more rounded edge? I'm thinking about ordering git rot to make sure the floor is solid around the driver seat as a preventative...Is that worth it based on my prior descriptions or should I just plan to rip it out? Do I need to worry about the stringers being hurt by the floor or is it purely there for seat mounting purposes? I don't want to open a can of worms that's unnecessary by tearing into there...but I also don't want to create a much bigger issue down the line. Again, thanks for everyone's help on this boat so far... |
Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: September-19-2016 at 5:29pm
Oh, you are going to open a can of worms.... the floor is a sign. If this boat is a keeper and your family can use it for YEARS, tear into it. Otherwise, patch it, smile and enjoy. Rarely is rot confined to "just a little spot"........... ------------- https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206 http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot 78 SkiTiq |
Posted By: fgroce
Date Posted: September-19-2016 at 9:37pm
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Hi I was looking into doing stringers on our 88 2001 and Cpes from the rot doctor. They had a real good article about treating plywood with and leaving it out in the weather for 3 years and still looked good. I ordered some to shoot up into the a platform mount holes and to try out on some wood pieces. Have to see how it does. ------------- FGroce 88 Ski Nautique For 28 years Now 2002 Ski Nautique |
Posted By: Donald80SN
Date Posted: September-19-2016 at 10:11pm
Guys, I am so flattered that you were impressed by my wood.   I wish I could of taken credit for the idea but the previous owner is an Engineer and he had several cool ideas like this that he had done to the boat and trailer. The bed liner is covering 3/4" plywood (Marine Grade maybe) and the liner covers the edges and covers only about two inches onto the bottom of the plywood. It repeals water very fast and gives your bare feet a nice texture rubber like traction when working with the wet trailer at launch and loading. It looks just like the black carpet. Basically, the bottom of the plywood is not covered with the bed liner coating. Maybe I can swing by the indoor storage center where she is kept to take a few quick photos latter this week. I just wish some of the ladies had noticed my fine wood. Donald ------------- 1980 Ski Nautique SOLD Back to Cypress Gardens 2002 Sport Nautique, GT-40, FCT2, Cover Sports, Tower Bimini, Inc., Wet Sounds Audio System, Star Gazer Wake Edition S. 1968 Ski Nautique, Project. |
Posted By: quinner
Date Posted: September-20-2016 at 9:49am
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Nice work Cousin Donald, key point here is encapsulating your wood in rubberized protection before dipping to ensure your wood will not get soft prematurely ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1143" rel="nofollow - Mi Bowt |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-20-2016 at 11:19am
Agreed. If you reaaaallly want to make sure, you could always glass it... I know I'm obsessing about the seat floor but I want to be sure I get this right before I button it up/fix it. I'm hesitant to tear it up too much so I've been careful about my poking and prodding... I think I'm going a little crazy, but I think I have a theory now on what I think is going on, and why it's been perplexing me (wood vs fiberglass/foam composite).
I think this may be what's going on... The only stuff I could find that appeared to have wood was directly along the hull. The holes starting in the front middle of the seat to the inside of the boat (basically the upper left corner to half way down the inside) are where there are actual holes in the fiberglass and where the guy put some cheapo anchors in to try and hold it down. The floor is solid here (I think I can compress the floor very slightly on the inside corner). When I look and poke around in there, I can't find a void where wood should be around the hole or any wood remnants, only about 1/2" of foam coming directly up to the bottom of the fiberglass. It is also bone dry (at least the 1/2' of foam that I can see). When wood is there how thick is it normally (1/4", 1/2"?)? When wood is used, I'm assuming that there is foam all the way up to it? On the front left corner, there is solid fiberglass approximately 1/2"-1" below the hole. Sorry for all of the questions, I just haven't been able to find pictures of a cross section of a glassed wood floor in this boat vs a foam backed fiber flooring replacement...and I know a lot of you guys have experience tearing into this stuff.
My plan is it's a keeper (~10 years). My kids are 3 and 7, my brother's are 5 and 7 and they will be the primary consumers. The gel is in great shape (I only could find one scratch on the back left corner, no spidering/cracking etc..., some oxidation), motor only has 380ish hours, two year old interior. So, I've ordered some git rot just in case and to treat any wood in the holes that I believe have it. Do you guys have any advise on epoxy/resin I could mix with something to help fill up the holes? I could use the git rot mixed with something like saw dust...but I'm thinking there's probably something better. I'm going to epoxy in whatever I am going to use to reinforce the larger holes and to try and seal them...the holes that are not stripped (or stripped badly) I'm going to plug, fill and redrill. I may also drill two additional holes in the front of the seat for added strength. |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: September-20-2016 at 11:38am
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It is starting to sound complicated and expensive so at this point I would say tear it out and do it right. The floor under the seats was likely the same 1X stock they made all wood stringer boats I have every seen. You are probably right that it has been repaired before... question is was it really repaired and the only problem is how he attached the seats, or was it not repaired at all or very poorly. I wouldn't waste git rot stuff on it, as unless there is dry but spongy wood down there that product wont do you any favors, Us composites sells epoxy, the minimum repair I would recommend is to get some cloth and get a hole saw and screw out some one inch plugs an inch or so deep on the holes no where near the side of the hull. If you like what you see in those holes fill them in with plugs and go over them with some layers of fiberglass... if you find wet wood then pull up the whole area under both seats dry out and repair in the off season. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-20-2016 at 12:58pm
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I'm making it complicated :)... I think some people might just hack it together and call it good. And sorry if I'm being overly verbose/stream of consciousness here, but I value all of your opinions and advice here to sanity check me. The holes that had stripped out/had anchors placed in them definitely don't have 1x (3/4"?) stock in them... I can't find any soft spots *except* a slight bending in a small spot where I believe it is all composite, everywhere else there is no give at all...everything appears to be dry and the git rot is more for since I'm in there it can't hurt to try and seal up the wood I believe is in some of the screw holes... (I'm not planning to add additional holes in the floor to add git rot and not looking at it as a "fix" for a soft floor, just a preventative). Nothing at all loose or soft on the passenger side. I think that the floor was replaced, and just screwed through the fiberglass with 0 reinforcement. Combine that with the guy admitting he sat on the back of the seat when pulling and I think that it just couldn't take the leverage. I agree with you that the correct repair is to take the 3-4 bad holes (ranging in size from 1/4" to maybe one that is 1/2") bore them out (checking for material to see if there is something worse) and then fill/epoxy/glass and redrill. |
Posted By: Air206
Date Posted: September-20-2016 at 2:31pm
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If the floor was replaced in the last few years, that seat shouldn't strip out - even with some dude sitting on the seat back....... unless there's cancer. Fix it up for now but be on the look out...... few people go through changing a floor for fun. And if it's new-ish, it should hold up for several years. ------------- https://tinyurl.com/y6t5e3bu" rel="nofollow - 04 Air206 http://tinyurl.com/9urzgls" rel="nofollow - 91 Barefoot 78 SkiTiq |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-20-2016 at 3:06pm
| Got it. PO said he didn't replace the carpet or floor and he owned it 5 years. So if redone > 5 years. |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-22-2016 at 11:44am
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Based on your recommendations, I grabbed a 1" hole saw and ended up cutting 7 holes out. My findings are this: - There has been no "patch" job done that I could find (consistent fiberglass/material throughout) - The construction appears to be bare plywood with 1/2" of foam on top of that with fiberglass on top of the foam (floor is floating on top) - Since I only had to go through a thin piece of fiberglass to investigate, I cut out two of the holes near the hull. The wood did not extend all the way to the hull and is not glassed to it...(bare wood) - Some of the holes (especially towards the back of the seat) have clean "brand new" looking wood in them (the screw hole itself was torn up). - Others were marginal but were solid and appeared to be dry - there is one "bad" hole, with some rot, the wood is still "there", rot was clearly tied to the screw hole and extended laterally a couple of inches on both sides about a 1/4" wide. MechGaT - I found your thread on the stringer job you did on your 92 SPN ( http://www.correctcraftfan.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=37914&title=1992-sport-floor-replacement" rel="nofollow - thread ). Great pictures and info, and if I end up there at least I have good reference. That's the only example I've been able to find of someone tearing apart a 92 SPN... Does my floor construction sound at all like yours? Also, I see that my bilge and every exposed area below the floor is pure white and yours appears to be grey/black? Wondering if that's stock on mine... I also have a round plastic "hatch" behind the engine for access to the output shaft/coupler. Again, the PO stated that the guy he bought it from said it had composite stringers...I'm wondering if it's had a stringer/floor job once already...assuming everybody *knew* what they were talking about and were being honest. So, what I'm doing for now is digging out the bad wood I found in the one hole (already done this, did not have rot all the way through), drying it, filling it with CPES and plugging all of the holes with 1" CPES soaked dowel rods after putting CPES in every cut out hole for good measure. Then I'm putting some fiberglass over the top of each hole, drilling and remounting the seat. This will then let me see if I have time/the location to rip out the flooring this winter or not. If not, I'm sure it will hold for at least a couple of seasons while I figure it out. In any event I think it's a terrible idea to have fiberglass, with a foam filled void, then bare wood THEN put a screw through that...would that really be stock? The fiberglass would flex up/down around the screw, opening the hole more and more and allowing even more water in than a wood backed fiberglass.... |
Posted By: TRBenj
Date Posted: September-22-2016 at 11:58am
| Pictures |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: September-22-2016 at 12:07pm
We all agree that construction would be a bad idea... it would also be different than any previously seen, You should definitely post pictures of the bilge area and what you have found... ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-22-2016 at 12:15pm
Here is one prior to me cutting out the holes (bad hole, but that is wood at the bottom): I had typed most of this up last night and just hadn't posted it yet, I ended up getting worried about having things "set" prior to weather coming (it's outside, covered, and I still have a few days before it's supposed to rain), so I've already plugged up the holes with the dowels. I should be able to break one or two free prior to glassing if you want to see what the bored out holes look like (or re hole saw it, they are just pressed in there with the thinned penetrating stuff and it's easy to make new ones). Are you looking for pictures of other parts of the boat? |
Posted By: JoeinNY
Date Posted: September-22-2016 at 12:44pm
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yes step back and take pictures that show the boat with the motor box out maybe the back panel out ... don't take apart what you have done it sounds like a reasonable repair for the time being ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=1477 - 1983 Ski Nautique 2001 1967 Mustang 302 "Decoy" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO5MkcBXBBs - Holeshot Video |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-28-2016 at 1:05am
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Sorry... still haven't had a chance to pull the motor box and floor aft and it's going to rain the rest of the week :(. I have these screw on balls with a tether to hold the motor box hinge. Are you supposed to be able to unscrew them without removing the screw they are tethered to? Here are some more pictures that I do have (not sure that it helps). I'll get some better full length pictures when I get a chance.       Things I've added to the list: - I think the RMS is leaking (didn't find any oil when I checked out originally, but now that the bilge is completely dry and it has been sitting, some drops of oil in the bilge)...will have to dig more to confirm source - Pitots NOT clogged, hoses broke off on outside - Trailer may need master cylinder - May need new rubber brake lines (electrical tape wth?) - tires more dry rotted than I thought (especially now that the boat has been sitting on them)...not sure they have to be replaced yet but... At least I got the wheel wells back from sandblasting and have those painted and ready to install...don't want to tow around without them |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: September-28-2016 at 10:48am
There are no nuts they just stab through the floor. |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-28-2016 at 11:03am
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DOH! thank you... I was working really hard trying to untwist... Side note, looking at lifts as people are trying to dump them. For a SPN, I was looking at 3500# and up lifts... would a 3000# one work ok (boat is ~2700 right?)? Reason I ask is there is a guy selling a lift fairly cheap. It has a painted galvanized cover (I think it's "custom" :) ). He has the brackets to put bunks on it. Here is the ad, would you guys consider it?: http://detroit.craigslist.org/okl/bpo/5799042434.html" rel="nofollow - link My biggest concern is that the top is ugly lol... |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: September-28-2016 at 11:11am
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Where did you see that lift is 3,000#? It looks like my old ShoreMaster 2500#, which held a Barefoot ok but not well. We eventually replaced it with a 4,000# I wouldn't spend $900 for just the lift but it would work and I kind of like top... |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: September-28-2016 at 11:13am
I ended up texting him and he said it was a 3000# lift, and told me the top was custom made... He could be wrong... |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: September-28-2016 at 11:51am
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The top does look custom made. If it really is a 120" inside/132" outside "pontoon" lift it is at least 3k. Stainless cables are nice, and not cheap. |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: October-04-2016 at 5:08pm
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I should be able to get some good photos tomorrow as I should have the boat back from winterization and at work.... I did not feel like attempting winterization myself yet, I winterize my tigershark (hehe) and the family pontoon every year but... I will probably try it next year, plus I wanted a so-called "pro" to look for anything I've missed and at least establish a mechanic I can trust (same place the PO serviced the boat at the last 2 years). It's earlier than I wanted to winterize (it's mid to upper 70s and sunny right now ugh)...but we're going on vacation soon and don't want to risk it. Anything additional to what the "pro" is doing I should check/do? I know the oil is being changed, trans fluid checked, engine fogged, stabil in fuel, alignment checked/adjusted, flushed with antifreeze... I'm having them pull the prop as it has a couple nicks...in my research I think the ACME 1442 is a potential good replacement if I go new? Best place to purchase from? Current is an OJ prop (I forget the dimensions but will grab tomorrow) that I will either get reconditioned or just keep as a spare (it's not "bad").... I've checked out the prop replacement procedure thread and it doesn't look horrible to get it properly mated to the shaft. |
Posted By: Hollywood
Date Posted: October-04-2016 at 5:20pm
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Winterization is fully covered in the manual. Don't bother with the drain plug on the tranny cooler or the tranny, pull the hose off the cooler bottom and suck out the tranny fluid. Everything else could be done to their spec. If you get all the water out nothing will break over winter, everything else is maintenance. It's not complicated. There should be plenty of info on the 89-91 stock 240 hp 1.23 transmission prop choices. Keep the OJ as is and in the garage as a spare, you'll likely never want to use it again after getting the appropriate Acme. |
Posted By: Blamey
Date Posted: October-04-2016 at 7:15pm
Delta propeller is a site sponsor. They generally have the best prices on ACME propellers I have seem plus you get 5% off with the code DP5CCF08 ------------- 96 Super Sport Previously: 95 Sport Nautique, 1980 Ski Supreme |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: October-06-2016 at 11:56am
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I do have some alignment work to do, I had them just pull it apart (since I haven't had time) and it's pretty far off, I posted a picture prior of the drive shaft entering the hull, looking like it was centered in the log but like the hull hole was off... the hull hole is not centered, however, the strut *is* misaligned. It doesn't look bent to me but like it is shimmed crooked (you can see it at the plate where it attaches to the hull)? I'll get a picture of that later... I will check for straightness with a straight edge then shim it if it's ok, cutlass appears to be ok but I'll need to verify (prop is off)...I don't understand how I could turn it with a finger or two if that off? Or maybe I misunderstood...it didn't spin "freely" but with constant resistance. Ok, here are some photos from yesterday to try and show the bilge etc (it all looks stock to me, and my "white" bilge comment must have been from using the flashlight on my phone and looking at the front of the bilge, otherwise I'm just on crack):        Is that fretting (eek) on the drive shaft from misalignment? Hope my tranny bearings are ok :(, there was no obvious vibration/noises and it shifts smoothly (EDIT: Included zoomed in picture):       Current prop is a 14x16 OJ 3 blade. BTW, marina PO'd me pretty bad, they smashed up the front of my motor box, they are going to fix it (I'll be doing my own "maintenance" from now on...). Obviously slammed the box down without it aligned with the floor wedges:  So... I guess I like to learn the hard way. But I sure as hell know a LOT more about these boats now because of this site and going through the pain myself. |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: October-07-2016 at 4:47pm
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Ok, here it is. I don't think I have fretting based on what I see (not a pro so please chime in)? I cleaned up the shaft and it looks much better. Does it look like it's the hull mount/plate that's crooked or is this thing bent? Do I assume the shaft is bent?           If I'm pulling the shaft...at that point I feel like I might as well pony up for an ARE... But if it is "ok" like it is, and I can monkey around pulling/fixing the strut etc... without touching the shaft then... EDIT: Added these, first one shows right angle flush with hull, next shows up against plate... looks like the plate is not perpendicular(!!!) and the strut is at least relatively straight:  
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Posted By: jimsport93
Date Posted: October-07-2016 at 9:58pm
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Strut looks bent to me. ------------- http://www.correctcraftfan.com/diaries/details.asp?ID=2798 - 93 Sport Nautique |
Posted By: fanofccfan
Date Posted: October-08-2016 at 11:24am
| +1 ^ Bent strut |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-08-2016 at 11:58am
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Paul, I agree with the others that the strut sure looks bent. Also, to me the shaft to coupling does look fretted. With a good interference press fit, there shouldn't be signs of rust at the bore. The only way to really tell is pulling the two apart and measuring. ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: Duane in Indy
Date Posted: October-08-2016 at 12:02pm
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pedricd qoute :If I'm pulling the shaft...at that point I feel like I might as well pony up for an ARE... I will be posting pics of machining a single taper shaft into a double taper shaft in a few days. The tapered coupling is about $65.00. To machine a taper onto the end of the shaft is not a huge undertaking and most local shops have a lathe capable. Save $$ by converting your current shaft if it is straight ------------- Keep it as original as YOU want it 1978 Mustang (modified) |
Posted By: 8122pbrainard
Date Posted: October-08-2016 at 1:07pm
Duane, Fantastic idea! Don't forget the woodruff key and then lapping the two together.  ------------- /diaries/details.asp?ID=1622" rel="nofollow - 54 Atom /diaries/details.asp?ID=2179" rel="nofollow - 77 Tique 64 X55 Dunphy Keep it original, Pete < |
Posted By: pedricd
Date Posted: October-11-2016 at 2:00am
Yeppers (edit: image was flipped):   EDIT: Also, what is up with the holes being off square?:  Best bet to send the strut to Delta and order a new ACME from them at the same time (1442 is what I am thinking, currently have OJ 14x16)? Order double taper shaft/ARE from where (with the potential fretting and possibly bent shaft I'm thinking I am probably better off just cutting the shaft off and putting an ARE in)? Shaft is still in the boat, so if I want to salvage I'll be needing to get some bolts to do the puller trick with the socket.. |